Jobless 'To Be Forced To Work' For Benefits

[grahamw48]

This country is WASTEFUL of its human resources.

Consider all of the skills that were flushed down the drain when we foolishly relinquished our manufacturing industries to the third world.

Were their skills utilised ? In the majority of cases....no.

Another thing. We are ASHAMED of people who are employed in sales and marketing.

Additionally, the whole system of production and marketing...indeed, EVERYTHING in daily life is smothered in added-cost red tape and regulation.

Simply put, as a country we have saddled ourselves with an enormous yoke.

I won't even go into the appalling standard of basic education in this country now....as a result of chasing targets and ticking boxes. The lowest common denominator rules !

Who cares if we're all dummies living in a second-rate country whose prospects are steadily getting more and more hopeless, while the rest of the world moves on past ?

[Ako Si Jamie]

This country is WASTEFUL of its human resources.

Consider all of the skills that were flushed down the drain when we foolishly relinquished our manufacturing industries to the third world.

So true.

[fred]

Good post Tone!!
Rep sent!

[Pete/London]

It all sounds like the return of the work houses from years ago.

Get the unemployed cleaning the streets, you wont need the street cleaners, they will lose their jobs, will have to sign on and then be put to work doing the same job, only for nothing, or rather their dole money.

[joebloggs]

I worked for a company for many years doing the work 99% of my colleagues couldn't manage. I also had offers from other firms but stayed loyal to these lot. When I was on HOLIDAY they phoned me up asking me to come in as they couldn't cope. In hindsight I would have told them to f off but like the loyal and committed worker I was, I went in.

And the thanks I got?

Not long after, I was rewarded with a 50% pay cut and at the same time, they were hiring people with zero experience on the same money.

Fair?

Within my rights to moan?

Wouldn't you?

loyalty

[gWaPito]

loyalty

The only loyalty I've got is for No1.....If my employer benefits then so be it...The extra miles I do is for me

[grahamw48]

It all sounds like the return of the work houses from years ago.

Get the unemployed cleaning the streets, you wont need the street cleaners, they will lose their jobs, will have to sign on and then be put to work doing the same job, only for nothing, or rather their dole money.

What street cleaners ?

They're already signing on by the look of my town.

Yes, please give some of these unemployed smackheads a brush and shovel, and give those who WANT to work some proper training that will actually get them a JOB, not just add to the profits of some privatised so-called training agency.

Clamp down on ageism too !

[joebloggs]

The only loyalty I've got is for No1.....If my employer benefits then so be it...The extra miles I do is for me

we agree on that, I've had to take an ex-employer to a tribunal in the past just to get my wages and i had known and worked for him for 10yrs

[joebloggs]

What street cleaners ?

They're already signing on by the look of my town.

shut down of council services, with the cuts from central gov they don't have the money to pay for the services any longer

[grahamw48]

shut down of council services, with the cuts from central gov they don't have the money to pay for the services any longer

Exactly, and that was why I wrote what I did in my complete post.

Councils being short of cash isn't going to change anytime soon, but the way the unemployed are treated/re-trained IS something that can be changed.

[les_taxi]

Even in Harrogate,there are plenty of tossers, who don't intend getting a job - why would they everything is free

Taxis to job centre

Lazy ..... I would give em basic food rations, house em in a communal shithouse till they make an effort to work
Any quality goods they have acquired - top trainers, big tvs etc I would have 'looked after' til they start working

[robbie bobby]

Lets face it there are going to be 2 different categories here.

Number 1. Those who would love to do any kind of work and for them it will not be an issue, It will help them gain self confidence and maybe whatever they are put doing might even end up a real job.

Number 2. Those that have no interest in working abnd are more than happy to scrounge from the rest of us that pay tax.

For the second group it will be in their eyes "forced labour" as they have no wish to work. Get them out there grafting

[Pete/London]

Clamp down on ageism too !

No, get rid of the coffin dodgers at 65 to make room for the youngsters.

If you tweak benefits a bit to make it the bare minimum and then up rates of pay to a proper living wage the problem will subside. Also make attendance at job centres more frequent.

I don't think a lot of the unemployed are lazy, just crafty, as I reckon most of them are working cash in hand somewhere.

[grahamw48]

Well, as you'll know Les, I spent 2 years working at the Harrogate 'dole office'.

Little has changed since I was there, apart from computerisation (they even use exactly the same basic forms, filled in by hand, and I can give you the ref. numbers of them ).

Still a lot of bone idle wasters signing on. Still a lot of genuine people trying to find work, but not supported and helped PROPERLY by PROFESSIONALS, AND often subject to unfair treatment by ignorant and unqualified recruitment 'consultants'.

There is far too much amateurism in the business world of this country, and far too many slackers, liars and cheats in positions of authority.

Most of my working life has been as a self-employed sales manager/sales trainer though, and the majority of that time working on a commission-only basis....just like my trainees.

Sink or swim. You get out what you've put in.

No hiding place for the feckless or the downright dishonest.

A lot of 'employed' people should try it sometime.

[grahamw48]

No, get rid of the coffin dodgers at 65 to make room for the youngsters.

If you tweak benefits a bit to make it the bare minimum and then up rates of pay to a proper living wage the problem will subside. Also make attendance at job centres more frequent.

I don't think a lot of the unemployed are lazy, just crafty, as I reckon most of them are working cash in hand somewhere.

Pete, some of us (I'm 62) will find that term offensive.

I'm all for opportunities for the young. My own son is 20, and needs a future.

However, there SHOULD be opportunities for all, if we can weed out some of the parasites and if our government (well, a succession of them) can get their heads out of their Rses and properly sort out some MEANINGFUL training and recruitment in this country, that will actually produce candidates able to do some productive work geared to current business and commerce.

[robbie bobby]

Yes I agree. I also worked for a certain Insurance company on a commission only and to be quite honest they were more good times than bad. My manager used to tell me keep knocking on the doors and it will turn out ok. That's what I did and I made a pretty penny too! It did get a bit disheartening tho. Good life experience

Well, as you'll know Les, I spent 2 years working at the Harrogate 'dole office'.

Little has changed since I was there, apart from computerisation (they even use exactly the same basic forms, filled in by hand, and I can give you the ref. numbers of them ).

Still a lot of bone idle wasters signing on. Still a lot of genuine people trying to find work, but not supported and helped PROPERLY by PROFESSIONALS, AND often subject to unfair treatment by ignorant and unqualified recruitment 'consultants'.

There is far too much amateurism in the business world of this country, and far too many slackers, liars and cheats in positions of authority.

Most of my working life has been as a self-employed sales manager/sales trainer though, and the majority of that time working on a commission-only basis....just like my trainees.

Sink or swim. You get out what you've put in.

No hiding place for the feckless or the downright dishonest.

A lot of 'employed' people should try it sometime.

[grahamw48]

Yes I agree. I also worked for a certain Insurance company on a commission only and to be quite honest they were more good times than bad. My manager uses to tell me keep knocking on the doors and it will turn out ok. That's what I did and I made a pretty penny too! It did get a bit disheartening tho.Good life experience

Ah, you'll understand where I'm coming from then Robbie.

(I think I've knocked every door in the North East of England...some, many times. Canvass manager was also one of my positions....getting the whip out over 6 teams ).

[les_taxi]

Said many times before, those who turn up at job centre, attend interviews - no problem well done to them, in fact what I would do is slowly reduce the amount we pay to the ones who don't attend interviews etc and give the extra bits to the ones who do - so weed out the lazy from the decent ones.

[Pete/London]

Pete, some of us (I'm 62) will find that term offensive.

Please accept my apologies, no offence meant

[joebloggs]

the way things are, some of us will have to work til we're nearly 70 before we can get a state pension

[Pete/London]

the way things are, some of us will have to work til we're nearly 70 before we can get a state pension

Well that's a micky take, most people in any kind of manual trade are not in good physical shape to carry on, even 65 was a struggle.

There was no mention of this adjustment 20 years ago, although personal pensions were being pushed I never heard the retirement age being mentioned.

[grahamw48]

Please accept my apologies, no offence meant

No probs, I should have put a wink after it.

[Michael Parnham]

have you ever been on the dole or benefits tone?, if not your are lucky sure sometimes you make your own luck and earn it, but bad-luck can come anyone's way , I've been on the dole thankfully the last and only time was under thatcher, not a place anyone wants to be



well being on benefits will not pay for a trip to the phils (nor should it) or a state pension (thou i think it should be enough that you can save something) , your wrong about the previous government, you mean previous governments, it was the same under thatcher and major as well as Blair.



if you've paid in, then you should be able to take out, if you haven't thats a different matter. those who paid in why should they do community work ?



you've answered my first question, but what about people who don't have any savings and have to sign on straight away, some people have applied for 100s of jobs and got nowhere, thou some people have probably never applied for a job, so you felt uncomfortable, what would you feel like after 6 months or a yr ?



i think anyone who works should get enough to live off, a crazy idea but a fair days pay for a fair days work , not all employers are the same tone, i know of people who have work for the same employer and not had a pay rise in 10 years, yet they live in £1m+ houses



and some people avoid paying tax, move money off shore, claim benefits they shouldn't.



obviously it depends on your age, I'm sure its more difficult to get a job for a someone in their 50's compared to someone who's in their 20's, also if your skills if you have any are in demand.

Talking about pay rises Joe, all my working life never had a pay rise in 50 years, I had to move to a different company every five years for my pay increase, never known a company that gave annual wage increases!

[fred]

Talking about pay rises Joe, all my working life never had a pay rise in 50 years, I had to move to a different company every five years for my pay increase, never known a company that gave annual wage increases!

Thats the way to do it Michael..
Don't moan about minimum wages and no pay rises.Just quietly plan to get another job!!
I used to find it tiresome listening to some people gripe for years about their employers for one reason or another, always threatening to leave..(miserable .....) I knew damned well they would be there for the rest of their lives...being miserable!!
Sad old buggers.

[fred]

Which reminds me.. I accepted a job offer once to build and scenic paint TV sets for a BEEB contractor..
I was on the job two days when the union rep called us to a meeting for a wage increase..
When asked for a show of hands I was the only one with my hand down..
Later when asked why,I told them that I had just signed a contract agreeing to terms and pay..
Only two days on the job and they were calling me a scab!!
Only in the U.K!!

[London_Manila]

So the smart thing to do is to make it a mission to BE a director!
If you have a problem with your pay then get another job.
If you think you are not qualified to get another job,GET qualified.
If you think that you can do a better job paying wages than your employer does, DO what he did.. Invest/risk your money,start a business and put YOUR money where your mouth is in your employees pockets!!

Otherwise...Work hard, be loyal to the guy that pays you and stop bloody moaning.
FACT..
Its boring.

Directors pay goes through roof and workers on the shop floor don't even get a pay rise

Thats not boring its a bloody disgrace and these fats cats don't like passing the rewards down to the workers

Actually my personal position is quite good and i am happy with my pay rates and working conditions
I do spare a thought for other people though and i feel sorry for many other workers in this country

FRED whether you agree with this or not many workers in this country are treated in a disgusting manner
The fat cats attitude is "well you should be lucky to have a job"
That kind of attitude does not inspire loyalty !

[gWaPito]

Directors pay goes through roof and workers on the shop floor don't even get a pay rise

Thats not boring its a bloody disgrace and these fats cats don't like passing the rewards down to the workers

Actually my personal position is quite good and i am happy with my pay rates and working conditions
I do spare a thought for other people though and i feel sorry for many other workers in this country

FRED whether you agree with this or not many workers in this country are treated in a disgusting manner
The fat cats attitude is "well you should be lucky to have a job"
That kind of attitude does not inspire loyalty !

Excellent response LM

[stevewool]

the way things are, some of us will have to work til we're nearly 70 before we can get a state pension

got my letter saying my retirement date is when i am 66, little do they know its well before that date

[joebloggs]

Talking about pay rises Joe, all my working life never had a pay rise in 50 years, I had to move to a different company every five years for my pay increase, never known a company that gave annual wage increases!

, thats some much for loyalty from your employer

[stevewool]

Talking about pay rises Joe, all my working life never had a pay rise in 50 years, I had to move to a different company every five years for my pay increase, never known a company that gave annual wage increases!

must agree with you on this Michael