Jobless 'To Be Forced To Work' For Benefits

[joebloggs]

At a rough guess.......... all that worked hard and progressed through the company.
Don't take my word for it though http://www.glassdoor.com/Salary/Tesc...ies-E10250.htm

half the jobs are less than £19k

[SimonH]

half the jobs are less than £19k

Which bit of "all that worked hard and progressed through the company" do I need to explain again
You asked how many employees of Tescos were on over £19k a year, I answered with statistics that proved if you worked your way up you get paid substantially more.
If you want shelf stackers and till operators to earn that sort of money, don't start complaining when a loaf of bread is £2 and 1/2 dozen eggs are £5

[joebloggs]

Which bit of "all that worked hard and progressed through the company" do I need to explain again
You asked how many employees of Tescos were on over £19k a year, I answered with statistics that proved if you worked your way up you get paid substantially more.
If you want shelf stackers and till operators to earn that sort of money, don't start complaining when a loaf of bread is £2 and 1/2 dozen eggs are £5

where are the statistics showing 'I answered with statistics that proved if you worked your way up you get paid substantially more.' i can't see them how many people worked their way up then ?

all it shows is most jobs pay under £19k, and others above it, so a shelf stacker can become a senior Business Systems Analyst at tesco ?, i wonder why they have a graduate scheme then, with store management, distribution and office programs for graduates then i wonder how many shelf stackers on minimum pay got that far

sure a few made it up the ladder but a bet a small number got into management no matter how hard they worked..

too many Indians and not enough jobs for chiefs for all to be paid £50k+ a year

[SimonH]

This is going no where, I did give you an example of my best friend who started in Sainsburys bakery part time who is now working in their London head office, but not everyone has the drive or inclination do succeed.
Maybe we should just agree to differ
In my ideal world the hard workers succeed and become chiefs, and I think your ideal world is a concept known as communism. Each to their own

[joebloggs]

1000s of shelf stackers, maybe even 100,000+
3,150 stores, so that's 3150 managers, i wonder how many Business Systems Analyst they have at tesco 100??
err that's out of a UK work force of over 310,000
http://www.tescoplc.com/index.asp?pageid=280

like i said not enough well paid jobs for everyone at the top no matter how hard they all work

[gWaPito]

Or maybe (just an off the wall thought) he got off his and did some good old fashioned work, used his initiative, got promoted and therefore paid more. Radical idea I know

hahaha you are funny Simon. .but, it's basically it. .didn't fancy being a poor socialist berating all and sundry wanting to get on in life. .I won't mention Joe

life is what it is so the way I see it is, either rub along or sink without trace without anybody giving a toss

just my humble opinion

[hawk]

but didnt a woman sue over the same thing on been made to go to work on human rights crap

[joebloggs]

hahaha you are funny Simon. .but, it's basically it. .didn't fancy being a poor socialist berating all and sundry wanting to get on in life. .I won't mention Joe

life is what it is so the way I see it is, either rub along or sink without trace without anybody giving a toss

just my humble opinion

so you joined a union gWaPito, your more of a socialist than me brother gWaPito, I've never been in a Union or got any benefits from a Union fighting for workers rights

always had to stand on my own 2ft with my employers

[SimonH]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fMKsR_wUSfA

[joebloggs]

and

[grahamw48]

You have good taste in comedy Joe.

[London_Manila]

Years ago, in the 40s 50s and to some degree the 60s, that's how us British lived. ..We did rumble together just like they do in these 3rd world countries. ..trouble is, we've become accustomed to living above our means. We've conveniently forgotten where we've come from in such a short space of time. ...people have forgotten how to survive and be happy

I fail to see how anyone can survive living in London on the minimum wage
Thats the same minimum wage the Tories informed us would bankrupt the country if it was introduced

[mickcant]

When I retired from the NHS in 2008, I was working in Supplies and my gross wage was around 11,000 a year, as were most of the jobs in support services for the workers.
Mick.

[London_Manila]

A Fact

If the minimum wage had gone up at the same rate as directors pay over the last 5 years it would be £19 an hour now

Before you Tory boys jump in and tell me that the companies cant afford it
Well the same companies have no problem in upping the directors pay to ridiculous levels

[fred]

A Fact

If the minimum wage had gone up at the same rate as directors pay over the last 5 years it would be £19 an hour now

So the smart thing to do is to make it a mission to BE a director!
If you have a problem with your pay then get another job.
If you think you are not qualified to get another job,GET qualified.
If you think that you can do a better job paying wages than your employer does, DO what he did.. Invest/risk your money,start a business and put YOUR money where your mouth is in your employees pockets!!

Otherwise...Work hard, be loyal to the guy that pays you and stop bloody moaning.
FACT..
Its boring.

[joebloggs]

Otherwise...Work hard,be loyal to the guy that pays you and stop bloody moaning.
FACT..
Its boring.

true,
but I've seen little loyalty from some employers to their workers thou

[gWaPito]

true,
but I've seen little loyalty from some employers to their workers thou

What do you suggest then Joe??...Perhaps get a job with 16 hrs per week so it doesn't upset one's benefits maybe??...or go the whole hog and not bother at all

[joebloggs]

What do you suggest then Joe??...Perhaps get a job with 16 hrs per week so it doesn't upset one's benefits maybe??...or go the whole hog and not bother at all

what's loyalty got to do with 16hrs aweek ?

GwaPito most wouldn't complain if they had the same pay and benefits you get from your employer gained thru your Union

[gWaPito]

what's loyalty got to do with 16hrs aweek ?

GwaPito most wouldn't complain if they had the same pay and benefits you get from your employer gained thru your Union

I've always been happy wherever I've worked....If I became unhappy, I'd move on to the next, it's as simply as that.

Most wouldn't complain of my pay and benefits but, that would change if they knew what I had to do to get it..everything comes with a price Joe....even so called good jobs...anyway, it's goodnight from him..I gotta be up in 4 hours to do it all again...You fancy it? I don't think so

[joebloggs]

I've always been happy wherever I've worked....If I became unhappy, I'd move on to the next, it's as simply as that.

.I gotta be up in 4 hours to do it all again...You fancy it? I don't think so

well GwaPito if you don't like it you know what you can do

i dont know always willing to give anything a try

[fred]

true,
but I've seen little loyalty from some employers to their workers thou

These days,Ive got the best employer Ive ever had in my life.He`s extremely loyal.
Me.

[joebloggs]

, never work for family or friends thou

i did some work experience at RBS cant remember if it was with school or college thou , no, its was when they were making money their downfall had nothing to do with me, but it prepares you for the world of work thou

[Ako Si Jamie]

Otherwise...Work hard,be loyal to the guy that pays you and stop bloody moaning.
FACT..
Its boring.

I worked for a company for many years doing the work 99% of my colleagues couldn't manage. I also had offers from other firms but stayed loyal to these lot. When I was on HOLIDAY they phoned me up asking me to come in as they couldn't cope. In hindsight I would have told them to f off but like the loyal and committed worker I was, I went in.

And the thanks I got?

Not long after, I was rewarded with a 50% pay cut and at the same time, they were hiring people with zero experience on the same money.

Fair?

Within my rights to moan?

Wouldn't you?

[Iani]

A Fact

If the minimum wage had gone up at the same rate as directors pay over the last 5 years it would be £19 an hour now

Before you Tory boys jump in and tell me that the companies cant afford it
Well the same companies have no problem in upping the directors pay to ridiculous levels

I'm going to guess that's a mixture of:

a. There's a lot more "normal workers" than directors, so a tiny increase to normal hard workers who could really do with an increase to buy things like........ummm....bread? Would cost a lot more than giving a few grand extra to the handful of directors.

b. Turkeys don't vote for Christmas, and directors decide pay.

Oh and don't get me started on golden handshakes/goodbyes.
Always the same though isn't it. £5000 wage rise is nothing to a director, but imagine how it could change the lives of the people who do the REAL work

[tone]

So the smart thing to do is to make it a mission to BE a director!
If you have a problem with your pay then get another job.
If you think you are not qualified to get another job,GET qualified.
If you think that you can do a better job paying wages than your employer does, DO what he did.. Invest/risk your money,start a business and put YOUR money where your mouth is in your employees pockets!!

Otherwise...Work hard,be loyal to the guy that pays you and stop bloody moaning.
FACT..
Its boring.

I personally think this is the crux of the issue and some of these words I tend to repeat to people who tell me I'm lucky.
One of the bottom lines here is that living on benefits should not pay the same as being in a job.
As I recall benefits are a temporary situation, not a lifestyle. Under the previous government they happily allowed too many people to make this a lifestyle.

The next bottom line is we can't afford to continue like this so making people do something that gives 'community back' will no doubt repay the community that helped them during unemployment.
I was out of work and still had bills and maintenance to pay - it took me 3 months to find a job and I didn't sign on until end of the first month but the whole process was very uncomfortable.

Company bosses are the people who are fruits of their own labour - they are the bosses because they took the lead. So why shouldn't they pay themselves what they think they are worth?
They educated themselves and raised their heads up, focused on developing their careers where a lot of unemployed people couldn't care less.
So the divide between some of these people will increase.

We live in a free enterprise society where you can get on the internet and learn a lot of skills, but you have to be bothered.

The last bottom line will be this - if this policy sees the light of day the new government won't repeal it, they may say they will but they won't because whoever wins the election will need to get their house in order.

And of course Ed balls will have a new credit card to go spending on.

I was in California last month in Silicon Valley and met a lot of IT people and they were all happy and smiling because whilst their education was paying they were paying a max of 35% tax and they saw plenty of their hard earned money..

There is no point taxing to the hilt a group of people because they will walk - as ever everything has to be balanced.
I would imagine a guy or girl on £100k is paying about £35k in tax and has no tax allowance. A guy in sainsburys earning £20k would be paying £2k a year. The statement that the rich should pay more is true - they are.

Let the lifestyle sponges earn their benefit but anyone who is on benefits for just a few months should be supported to find another job.. I mentioned when is out of work, the job centre couldn't help me find a job.. But they had to see I was trying..

[grahamw48]

Good post Tone.

Benefits shouldn't be there to support a 'lifestyle' either, IMO.

The basics.

Need more, start selling your stuff, get rid of the 5 dogs and cats, give up smoking, etc. Might concentrate the mind on finding work.

[tone]

Good post Tone.

Benefits shouldn't be there to support a 'lifestyle' either, IMO.

The basics.

Need more, start selling your stuff, get rid of the 5 dogs and cats, give up smoking, etc. Might concentrate the mind on finding work.

Thanks Graham the other one is Sky TV!

[grahamw48]

True !

You'd think they'd be too busy looking for a blinkin job !

[Arthur Little]

Good post Tone.

... yours's a very sensible viewpoint, Tone!

[joebloggs]

I personally think this is the crux of the issue and some of these words I tend to repeat to people who tell me I'm lucky.

have you ever been on the dole or benefits tone?, if not your are lucky sure sometimes you make your own luck and earn it, but bad-luck can come anyone's way , I've been on the dole thankfully the last and only time was under thatcher, not a place anyone wants to be

One of the bottom lines here is that living on benefits should not pay the same as being in a job.
As I recall benefits are a temporary situation, not a lifestyle. Under the previous government they happily allowed too many people to make this a lifestyle.

well being on benefits will not pay for a trip to the phils (nor should it) or a state pension (thou i think it should be enough that you can save something) , your wrong about the previous government, you mean previous governments, it was the same under thatcher and major as well as Blair.

The next bottom line is we can't afford to continue like this so making people do something that gives 'community back' will no doubt repay the community that helped them during unemployment.

if you've paid in, then you should be able to take out, if you haven't thats a different matter. those who paid in why should they do community work ?

I was out of work and still had bills and maintenance to pay - it took me 3 months to find a job and I didn't sign on until end of the first month but the whole process was very uncomfortable.

you've answered my first question, but what about people who don't have any savings and have to sign on straight away, some people have applied for 100s of jobs and got nowhere, thou some people have probably never applied for a job, so you felt uncomfortable, what would you feel like after 6 months or a yr ?

Company bosses are the people who are fruits of their own labour - they are the bosses because they took the lead. So why shouldn't they pay themselves what they think they are worth?

i think anyone who works should get enough to live off, a crazy idea but a fair days pay for a fair days work , not all employers are the same tone, i know of people who have work for the same employer and not had a pay rise in 10 years, yet they live in £1m+ houses

I would imagine a guy or girl on £100k is paying about £35k in tax and has no tax allowance. A guy in sainsburys earning £20k would be paying £2k a year. The statement that the rich should pay more is true - they are.

and some people avoid paying tax, move money off shore, claim benefits they shouldn't.

Let the lifestyle sponges earn their benefit but anyone who is on benefits for just a few months should be supported to find another job.. I mentioned when is out of work, the job centre couldn't help me find a job.. But they had to see I was trying..

obviously it depends on your age, I'm sure its more difficult to get a job for a someone in their 50's compared to someone who's in their 20's, also if your skills if you have any are in demand.