Stark choice under new immigration rules: exile or family breakup

[lastlid]

Should a sponsor's minimum income proposal be introduced to the Immigration Rules, it could be perceived as a disproportionate interference in the right to a private and family life (Article 8), as well as discriminatory, and thereby 'incompatible' with the HRA. After all, it is 'not fair' that one person can have their foreign spouse settle simply because they earn x amount, whereas the bloke next door can't because he falls shy of an arbitrary threshold. [/I]

Interesting.

[joebloggs]

whats even more interesting, a paradox
if your earning probably less than £25k a year you might be entitled to legal aid and challenge the decision by taking the gov to court

[lastlid]

whats even more interesting, a paradox
if your earning probably less than £25k a year you might be entitled to legal aid and challenge the decision by taking the gov to court

[Steve.r]

Not read every post here, but my son has a British passport, therfore he is English, does 'dependant children' mean:for example 'my son' or would it mean children of your spouse who are not biologically yours or not holding a British passport ?

[joebloggs]

also i would have thought those who dont work, retired or can't work thru illness or a disability will have an even stronger article 8 case. like i said a big can of worms and it will all end with egg on may's face

[joebloggs]

Not read every post here, but my son has a British passport, therfore he is English, does 'dependant children' mean:for example 'my son' or would it mean children of your spouse who are not biologically yours or not holding a British passport ?

I'm a bit confused also, because i originally thought it would apply to those kids who are not British, eg step-kids in the phils but from the article, the lady who is British and pregnant with twins would need to earn more than the 25k, so it appears they are applying it to kids already in the UK!, i suppose we will have to wait and see.

[Steve.r]

This is all so wrong on so many levels.

But like my son, he already has british citizenship, will it apply ?? I cant see how it can, he already has the right to be here.

[Robert86]

actually i recieved a letter from the home office last year after i contacted Theresa May, i got no reply but received the letter after a few weeks and it did state that changes will come into affect sometime throughout 2012.. im not surprised at all. disgrace, this country is going down the pot.

[Steve.r]

this country is going down the pot.

I think we can all agree with that statement

[Robert86]

how long would these proposals take to get through the house of commons and the house of lords?

[gWaPito]

how long would these proposals take to get through the house of commons and the house of lords?

At a guess, not long. The goverment are going through a torrid time at the moment....these proposals would be very popular with the majority of the electorate...a major feather in the coalitions cap.

Ill admit im slightly right wing but, these proposals are at the least, extreme. Too much, in fact.

[grahamw48]

This has NOTHING to do with British citizens wishing to bring Filipinos into this country.

It has EVERYTHING to do with gormless people being taken in by refugees, illegal immigrants and asylum seekers, as well as certain Indian sub-continent immigrant communities (who DON'T integrate) bringing in grandmas, cousins, wives, etc etc by the dozen. Hence the new language and integration requirements.

This is GROSSLY unfair and is discriminating against honest law-abiding British citizens....born and bred here, who have forged genuine relationships.

If they want to discriminate, then pick on the 'British' people who's families have been in this country no more than 50 years and owe no allegiance to us or our culture and way of life...as is clearly evidenced by their refusal to integrate and accept our Western values.

[bigmarco]

It will be interesting when/if this goes before the house. Are the liberals seriously going to support this as they will doubtless consign themselves to the politcal dustbin if they do.
Also the human rights lawyers will have a field day with this. There will be untold cases going to the ECHR as this will have to be tested as it will clearly breech peoples rights under article 8.

[gWaPito]

This has NOTHING to do with British citizens wishing to bring Filipinos into this country.

It has EVERYTHING to do with gormless people being taken in by refugees, illegal immigrants and asylum seekers, as well as certain Indian sub-continent immigrant communities (who DON'T integrate) bringing in grandmas, cousins, wives, etc etc by the dozen. Hence the new language and integration requirements.

This is GROSSLY unfair and is discriminating against honest law-abiding British citizens....born and bred here, who have forged genuine relationships.

If they want to discriminate, then pick on the 'British' people who's families have been in this country no more than 50 years and owe no allegiance to us or our culture and way of life...as is clearly evidenced by their refusal to integrate and accept our Western values.

I agree Graham..its a poor show...IF this stuff does go through, the conservative party will be losing my vote.

Like you said the other day, the likes of us are being tarred with those law breaking parasites.
Still, the rest of the country wont worry about a small detail like that Given the fact war criminal blair took us, in my opinion, to a illegal, morally unjust war. I dont think the present administration will lose any sleep passing this rubbish.

[grahamw48]

I agree with you on the war...Afghanistan too.

ANY war in the mid-east for that matter.

Keep our noses and money out of their primitive damned countries, not to mention the lives of our youngsters.

Always been on a hiding to nothing there, unless you obliterate them, as we're quite capable of doing...but never will, so pointless. Like cockroaches they run away and hide, to crawl out later.

[gWaPito]

I'm a bit confused also, because i originally thought it would apply to those kids who are not British, eg step-kids in the phils but from the article, the lady who is British and pregnant with twins would need to earn more than the 25k, so it appears they are applying it to kids already in the UK!, i suppose we will have to wait and see.

Actually Joe, the woman in question was able to stay in the uk with her twins...the nub comes when she wants to bring in her non euro husband......bearing in mind the base level will be set at 25k or there abouts...her annual income being 31k.5 k is deemed not enough to support her family with out the need to go to the public purse.

The only way to get her hubby here is either to get a better paying job or exile this country for his.

The situation for steve is, he can bring his son over from Philippines without any problems..he, the son, is after all British citizen....the nub comes when steve's wife wants to come over as well...now im not sure what the sliding scale is for a wife and son but, you bet your bottom dollar its much more than the base 25k.

The woman in the example was on 31.5 k and that wasn't enough for 2 kids.

Also what about the thousands of filipina already here and settled but, with childrens still in the Philippines with plans on coming over here at a later date?

[yellowcloud]

What about people who have already applied for a spouse or fiance visa and are waiting for an Answer? As my Fiance applied for her Fiance visa this week!

[Arthur Little]

There but for the grace of God, go I ...............

... AND me, Peter.

Have to agree with gWaPito, people are not going to risk the huge application fees if they clearly don't meet the criteria of Income Thresholds.

... that's precisely what the Government is banking on - the fewer direct sponsors who can afford the proposed income levels (since the plan is also to disallow third party support) the fewer the number of applicants.

Any legislation has to be 'compatible' with the terms of the Human Rights Act 1998. If it's incompatible, that legislation can be struck out by the courts. The HRA provides a national remedy to the European Convention on Human Rights, which was signed by the UK eons ago. Previously, if someone wished to assert that their 'human rights' had been infringed, then remedy would have to have been sought through the European Court for Human Rights - so costly as to generally not be worth it.

from davis Khan - immigration associates.

I'd been going to mention the International Human Rights Organisation. But ... BANG goes this theory if, by any chance, it STILL HAS to entail drawn out and costly action involving the ECHR initially.

[Robert86]

anyone ive spoke to just thinks this is completely ridiculous.. not really about if your british or non european, its about what class you are... sounds like discrimination

[yellowcloud]

Robert, has your Wife already applied for a Spouse Visa?

[Robert86]

no not yet, will start in the next couple of months.. she has her ielts exam on the 19th june..

[Robert86]

basically if you earn under 26k you dont have the right to bring your wife/husband to the UK.. that in itself is discrimination.. an "anti-family" law.... disgrace.

[yellowcloud]

Good she has her English test coming up soon, you should have enough time for her to apply before any changes.

[yellowcloud]

if your earning probably less than £25k a year you might be entitled to legal aid and challenge the decision by taking the gov to court

I dont see how as the legal Aid thresehold is £7,000 not £25,000?

[Robert86]

Good she has her English test coming up soon, you should have enough time for her to apply before any changes.

thanks i really hope so.. but these proposals by the government are shocking..

[Robert86]

26k is such a high threshold.... as long as you are in full-time employment, have good savings and in no arrears and a roof over your head surely that is enough??

[yellowcloud]

No Probs,


An application is usually decided according to the rules in place on the date the application was made .

It depends on what the particular Statement of Changes in Immigration Rules says (UK Border Agency | Statements of changes in Immigration Rules).
Such as

“The changes in paragraphs 5, 11 and 13 set out in this Statement shall take effect on 14 June 2012. However, if an applicant has made an application for entry clearance or leave before 14 June 2012 and the application has not been decided before that date, it will be decided in accordance with the rules in force on 13 June 2012.”

Occasionally (usually for legal reasons) it is necessary to bring rules into force for all applications at the same time. If a particular Statement of Changes does not contain a paragraph like the one above, then applications are decided according to the rules in place on the date the ECO decides the application even if the application and payment were made earlier. This is quite rare though".

What you need to pray for is that there is a transitional arrangement rather than it being retrospective.

[Robert86]

i can just hope and pray this does not affect are application..

[lastlid]

Anybody got any thoughts on this so called Attachment Test? Apparently modelled on the Danish approach.

[joebloggs]

Actually Joe, the woman in question was able to stay in the uk with her twins..

The only way to get her hubby here is either to get a better paying job or exile this country for his.

i would hope she could stay gWaPito she is British and so will be her kids when they are born

but your right about the rest of the post, but as she is British and her kids are British (not that it matters) she is entitled to claim benefits she is entitled to claim for herself and her kids, no matter who she is married to (a brit, a European, non European or even a Martian!)

she could go and live in another European country, get a job and use the family permit route to bring him back to the UK, not particle for many but possible,

yes it will effect those hard working Filipinos who planned to bring their kids here, its possible they will need to earn what about £38k for 1 child, and £12.5k extra a year for each additonal kid