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  1. #31
    Moderator fred's Avatar
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    Here, we find ourselves questioning whether we should go and spend 40 quid to go and see the GP about something, or hope that the ailment goes away on its own.
    How much !!! 40 Quid?
    When did all that start?


  2. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by fred View Post
    How much !!! 40 Quid?
    When did all that start?
    I'm no expert on cost of attending a GP and healthcare in Oman, but I'm sure Ricky is - he pays the bills, and the only surprise is they're not more !

    If patients in the UK DID have to pay up front for attending their doctor and having treatment, they might realise the true cost of healthcare ( 10% of our GDP ). It's possible that might motivate them to better look after their health by their " lifestyle choices ".
    However, it has to be said that increasing dental charges haven't helped dental health.

    The majority of filipinos cannot afford the healthcare we take for granted in the UK ( despite the shortcomings of the NHS ) - one factor in their life expectancy being about a decade less than here in the UK.

    It's just unfortunate that, as the GBD study showed - the last decade of life in the UK is lived in poor health for so many people, as a result of our " toxic " lifestyle. Not my judgement, just the facts.


  3. #33
    Moderator fred's Avatar
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    Sorry.. I must have either mis read or misinterpreted as I thought he was talking about UK costs to see a GP.
    I`ll be quite honest and suggest that I think that the UK are on the brink of NOT being able to afford or sustain the NHS at all.
    I think everyone in the UK is in for a huge shock in future years regarding many things financial after interest rates ultimately rise.
    I also suggest that everyone makes the most of the NHS whilst they can.
    No offence intended... Just my opinion.


  4. #34
    Respected Member andy222's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steve.r View Post
    Can I ask just 'how' you have noticed this Andy?

    Thanks for your report Alan. I always find it interesting to see and read your comparisons backed by your non-judgemental advice. I think we all know we should change our lifestyles in some ways, but old routines, day to day habits all hinder our good intentions. But we can try.
    Interesting too, that you mention 'alternative medicine' after the recurrence of the older thread on Homeopathy.
    Ok Steve I work for the NHS in the community and on the wards in hospitals as well as end of life units. That is how I have noticed. Hope this as answered your question mate.

    And Doc is a mine of info thanks to him for sharing his knowledge and experience.


  5. #35
    Respected Member andy222's Avatar
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    Healthcare is free to a certain extent in the uk but I can assure you of this morale is at a all time low reguarding staff due to government cuts. They are draining us of manpower. That makes mistakes more inevitable.


  6. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by andy222 View Post

    And Doc is a mine of info thanks to him for sharing his knowledge and experience.
    Thanks Andy - comments like yours make it all worthwhile, really appreciated


  7. #37
    Respected Member andy222's Avatar
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    No problem Doc just telling the truth.


  8. #38
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    Life expectancy at birth is now 67 for males and 72 for females in the Philippines ; compared with 79 for males and 83 for females in the UK. Global life expectancy now averages 71.5 years – but it’s less for HEALTHY life expectancy. So-called " health-adjusted life expectancy " is approaching a decade less for males and females in both the Philippines and the UK. Such estimates depend on measures like " QALYs " ( quality-adjusted life years ) and " DALYs " ( disability-adjusted life years ).


    • Of course none of us know how long we will live. Even analysis of our genetic make up won’t tell us that. Estimates of life expectancy ( healthy or otherwise ) also vary in different parts of the country we live in. We do know that life expectancies have increased over many years, especially in countries such as the Philippines. This may be explained by successes in medicine and public health. It’s disappointing, therefore, that on average the last decade of our lives as " senior citizens " may not be completely healthy – even if not too surprising.


    • The UK spends under 10% of its GDP on health ; the Philippines under 5% ; " out-of-pocket " expenditure is about 10% in the UK and over half in the Philippines.

    ALL medicine should be based on good evidence, not opinions and non-evidence based meddling ! Healthcare and social care also need to be integrated ( as planned for Manchester ).

    If ONLY politicians would declare how much of the GDP is to be spent on health ( with a tax dedicated to health ), and devolve control of such spending to healthcare workers !



    • We should all know the risk factors for ill health ! They include smoking ( 44% males and 10% females in Philippines ; 22% for each in UK ) ; alcohol consumption ( twice as much in the UK ) ; obesity ( just over 6% in Philippines ; about a third in the UK ); lack of exercise ; poor diet ( excess sugar, lack of fruit / vegetables ) ; untreated high blood pressure and diabetes ; late diagnosis of cancers.



    • The differences between the UK and the Philippines are marked, but not so much as in the past. " Non-communicable diseases " now account for about two thirds of deaths in the Philippines – compared to 90% of those in the UK.

    Cardiovascular diseases account for about a third in each country. Cancers account for another third in the UK ; 10% in the Philippines ( the main types are different, but frequency increases with age ). Chronic lung diseases account for less than 10% in each country. Diabetes kills relatively more in the Philippines ( 6% ) than the UK ( 1% ). Communicable ( such as TB ), maternal, perinatal and nutritional conditions are relatively more significant in the Philippines ( a quarter ) compared to UK ( under a tenth ).



    • Of course there are still differences in health profiles between the two countries – 80% of the UK population live in urban areas compared to 50% in the Philippines ; gross national income per capita is over 8 times as high in UK ; the UK has relatively greater health workforce ( 42 doctors compared to 7 / 10,000 ), with far easier access ( free where it is needed ) than the Philippines ; more reliance on " complementary / alternative / traditional " non-evidence based medicine in the Philippines ; health screening, prevention or at least early diagnosis of illness more established in the UK.


    • For members who do wish to know more about comparison of health between the UK and the Philippines, these links may be of interest :-


    1. Country profiles :-


    http://www.who.int/nmh/countries/gbr_en.pdf

    http://www.who.int/nmh/countries/phl_en.pdf?ua=1


    http://www.who.int/gho/countries/gbr.pdf?ua=1


    http://www.who.int/gho/countries/phl.pdf?ua=1


    2. Global Burden of Disease Study :-


    http://www.thelancet.com/journals/la...682-2/abstract


    3. Cost of being unhealthy ( England ) :-


    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-30934590


  9. #39
    Respected Member Michael Parnham's Avatar
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    Only just come across this thread Alan, brilliant, enjoyed reading all the posts and certainly food for thought, keep up the good work!


  10. #40
    Trusted Member stevewool's Avatar
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    I am afraid the free right to the health care here is slowly going, yes it will be there for those who cannot pay, ie people from Europe, but the honest English worker will have to pay for some sort of insurance policy in due time - of that I am sure, just my thoughts


  11. #41
    Moderator Arthur Little's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by stevewool View Post
    I am afraid the right to the free health care here is slowly going. Yes, it will be there for those who cannot pay, ie people from Europe, but the honest English worker will have to pay for some sort of insurance policy in due time - of that I am sure, just my thoughts
    ... and the honest Scottish, Welsh & Northern Irish workers too, no doubt!


  12. #42
    Trusted Member mickcant's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arthur Little View Post
    ... and the honest Scottish, Welsh & Northern Irish workers too, no doubt!
    What about the Isle of Wight
    Mick.


  13. #43
    Moderator Arthur Little's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mickcant View Post
    What about the Isle of Wight
    Mick.
    , Mick! Yep, you're absolutely right ... Isle of Wight; also the Isle of Man. And, of course, the Channel Islands, for that matter.

    ... 'fraid each of those separate locations only entered my head after typing #41.


  14. #44
    Respected Member robbie bobby's Avatar
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    Here in Channel Islands(Guernsey)everyone pays £45 for Doctor and £25 for a nurse appointment.Prescriptions are £3.70 unless its for something like contraception which comes under"private"and costs £12.00.If you need an ambulance you pay £200 unless you join a healthcare scheme here which costs approx £40 a month per person which pays all docs and ambulance fees.Once you have seen the doctor and he/she refers you to hospital its free but a simple appearance at A+E will still incur a £45.00 charge Mon-Fri before 6pm.After 6 pm and weekends its a more heftier charge of £90.

    This week so far I have paid out £300.00 for Doctors.1x appointment for wife.3x appointments for the baby as shes ill and 2 for me as I had a chest infection and high blood pressure which saw me spending £92 for a monitor to be put on for 24 hours.The standard cost is £57 for doctor for a visitor but the government pays a grant of £12.00 if you live here.There are some pros.You can get seen by a doctor in the same day.Your bloods/pathology comes back after 24 hours and whatever you have is treated.if you need to go to hospital for an op there isn't this 3 month wait like you have in UK


  15. #45
    Trusted Member stevewool's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by robbie bobby View Post
    Here in Channel Islands(Guernsey)everyone pays £45 for Doctor and £25 for a nurse appointment.Prescriptions are £3.70 unless its for something like contraception which comes under"private"and costs £12.00.If you need an ambulance you pay £200 unless you join a healthcare scheme here which costs approx £40 a month per person which pays all docs and ambulance fees.Once you have seen the doctor and he/she refers you to hospital its free but a simple appearance at A+E will still incur a £45.00 charge Mon-Fri before 6pm.After 6 pm and weekends its a more heftier charge of £90.

    This week so far I have paid out £300.00 for Doctors.1x appointment for wife.3x appointments for the baby as shes ill and 2 for me as I had a chest infection and high blood pressure which saw me spending £92 for a monitor to be put on for 24 hours.The standard cost is £57 for doctor for a visitor but the government pays a grant of £12.00 if you live here.There are some pros.You can get seen by a doctor in the same day.Your bloods/pathology comes back after 24 hours and whatever you have is treated.if you need to go to hospital for an op there isn't this 3 month wait like you have in UK
    Interesting


  16. #46
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    Shortly after we arrived my wife had a fever and cough she couldn't get rid of. The pharmacies are pretty strict about not giving out antibiotics over-the-counter, which meant a visit to a doctor.
    My wife was getting concerned about this cough so we made a trip to the hospital.
    The doctor's charge for consultation was P200
    We just knocked on the door and went straight in. No appointment and no waiting.
    My wife had a couple of chest X-Rays done (clear thank goodness) at a cost of P150 each.
    Antibiotics prescribed which I think cost about P150 for the course.


  17. #47
    Trusted Member stevewool's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Terpe View Post
    Shortly after we arrived my wife had a fever and cough she couldn't get rid of. The pharmacies are pretty strict about not giving out antibiotics over-the-counter, which meant a visit to a doctor.
    My wife was getting concerned about this cough so we made a trip to the hospital.
    The doctor's charge for consultation was P200
    We just knocked on the door and went straight in. No appointment and no waiting.
    My wife had a couple of chest X-Rays done (clear thank goodness) at a cost of P150 each.
    Antibiotics prescribed which I think cost about P150 for the course.
    Each to their own they say, but this is the way it should be done.
    A correct amount for an excellent service. The trouble is, over here in England, money you pay will go towards other things they say are more important. Just my thoughts.


  18. #48
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    • OUR NHS is STILL largely free at the " point of use " ( which is what counts when you’re ill ), although some payments may have to be made towards the cost, such as prescriptions, eye tests, and dental fees.


    • UK population is about 2/3 of that in the Philippines ( 65 million / 104 million ). UK GDP is estimated around £ 1,800 billion, 10 times that of the Philippines. The UK spends over 9%, and Philippines 4.5%, of GDP on health. " Out-of –pocket " expenditure on health in the UK is about a tenth of total health spending, compared to about 60% in the Philippines. General government expenditure on health in the UK is over 80%, compared to about a third in the Philippines.


    • The NHS costs about £ 140 billion annually for the UK, and of course it has to be paid for, almost entirely by taxation.



    • If you are not exempt from paying for a prescription, its charge is NOT for the true cost of the drugs, and certainly not for the entire diagnosis and treatment of any condition. Although average net costs vary around the UK ( between about £ 7.50 and £ 10.60 per item ) some drugs, such as for cancer treatment, cost FAR more than this. Conversely, some are cheaper and would be best bought " over-the-counter " where possible.


    • The commonest drugs prescribed include " Simvastatin " ( for lowering blood cholesterol ); " Omeprazole " ( antacid ); " Co-codamol " and "Aspirin " ( pain relief ).


    • There doesn’t appear to be enough doctors in the Philippines ( 80,000 members of the Philippines Medical Association, compared to around 275,000 doctors on the UK GMC list of " Registered Medical Practitioners " ). At least 2/3 Filipino health care professionals work in the private sector.



    • Overall life expectancy in the UK is at least 81 - 12 years longer than Philippines. 1 in 3 people in the UK can expect to live to 100 ; half diagnosed with cancers live over 10 years ; 1/5 UK adults are overweight and another 1/5 smoke ( increasing risks of many illnesses ) ; at least 850,000 in the UK have dementia.



    • In the Philippines there is unfair and inequitable access to healthcare leaving the poor behind. Problems include low overall government spending on health ; high " out-of-pocket " spending ; high numbers of maternal and newborn deaths ; high fertility rates among the poorest Filipinas ; and the continuing challenge of communicable diseases like TB, dengue, HIV/AIDS - despite 2/3 illnesses now being " non-communicable " ( like heart disease and cancers ). Philippines Medical Association claims 2/3 Filipinos die without seeing a healthcare worker.




    • A well-functioning healthcare system should provide equitable access to quality healthcare regardless of capacity to pay, and protect against financial consequences of ill health. In the UK, that means universal healthcare ( or at least treatments " NICE " deems effective and value for money ), to a standard that’s safe and effective, and keeping to the budget.



    • We need tough and well – informed health service leaders, preferably healthcare workers. The English Health Secretary doesn’t understand the NHS and has alienated senior and junior doctors and other healthcare workers. He doesn’t acknowledge we already have a 24/7 NHS ; has accused consultants of " opting out " when they don’t ; refused decent pay rises for nurses ; and presided for too long over hospitals run according to financial not clinical needs.


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