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18th September 2009 #31
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[QUOTE=Ross;174106]well said and very much appreciated it help us more to realize things better before hand we aware of this things so its all good
do you think if we apply in next few months he need to move on and find that suitetable place before we lodge our application isnt it ok for them to show and able to see that renting place is seems new or he need to show that he has stay there for long time before we lodhe our application, as they can see on rent books or tenancy, agreement or it does matter as long as its there shows the place are suits for us all
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18th September 2009 #32
[QUOTE=Ross;174108]That should be your main priority before you submit an application. It won't matter if he hasn't lived there very long as long as the accomodation is suitable for a couple with three children, his tenancy is secure and he has a letter from his landlord to prove this.
What are the ages and sex of the 3 children, because this can make a difference as to whether the ECO will decide that the accomodation has enough bedrooms. I don't know the exact details of how they work this out, but it usually means that children above a certain age should not be expected to share a bedroom with another child of the opposite sex.
Iain.
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18th September 2009 #33
Ross
He needs to move on & find something suitable, so the NEW accomodation
will be the one you present in your Visa application.
In the UK, a tenancy agreement is usually for a minimum of 6mnths, so that
will show his "commitment"
He merely needs to state (in his covering letter) that he's recently moved
to accomodation more suitable to the needs of a young family.
No man is an island, but Barry is
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18th September 2009 #34
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18th September 2009 #35
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18th September 2009 #36
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18th September 2009 #37
Ross - here is simple answer, it is from document called Entry Clearance Guidance and it is used by ECOs as a guideline s when assessing the applications:
The Housing Act 1985 contains statutory definitions of overcrowding in residential housing. The ECO should bear in mind, as Pakistan 2004 UKAIT 000066 says, that adequacy of accommodation must be assessed on an individual basis. It is not enough to equate adequacy with overcrowding.
A house is considered to be overcrowded if 2 persons aged 10 years or more of opposite sexes, who are not living together as husband and wife, must sleep in the same room. The Act also details the maximum number of people allowed for a given number of rooms or a given room floor area.
Account is taken only of rooms with a floor area larger than 50 square feet and rooms of a type used either as a living room or bedroom.
Rooms such as kitchens or bathrooms are excluded.
Under the Housing Act, the number of people sleeping in accommodation must not exceed the following:
Number of rooms Maximum number of people allowed
1..............................1
2..............................2
3..............................5
4..............................7.5
5..............................10
Each additional room in excess of 5 = an additional 2 people
For the purpose of the Act:
* a child under one does not count as a person.
* a child aged 1-10 years counts as only half a person.
source: UKBA - ECG - mainatenance and accommodationJiri & Maricel
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18th September 2009 #38
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18th September 2009 #39
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18th September 2009 #40
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hi ian my wife went to embassy in mckinlay and was told she had to make an appointment so phoned embassy yesterday to be told the no longer provide that facilty so my wife phoned after me and she was given a fax number and we faxed the new evidence that wasnt submitted orginaaly with the refusal letters from the eco this was after 12 today so wont know anything until monday thanks for your concern tom
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18th September 2009 #41
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hi ian my wife went to embassy in mckinlay and was told she had to make an appointment so phoned embassy yesterday to be told the no longer provide that facilty so my wife phoned after me and she was given a fax number and we faxed the new evidence that wasnt submitted orginaaly with the refusal letters from the eco this was after 12 today so wont know anything until monday thanks for your concern tom
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18th September 2009 #42
good luck and hopefully it will be over turned
a room in a shared house is very risky with 3 kids, how many other people live in the house with your husband ?
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18th September 2009 #43
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19th September 2009 #44
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21st September 2009 #45
thanks for this info
hi Ji&Ma,
This is why I love this site, everybody is just so helpful and to think that we haven't really known each other personally, it's just so nice to know that people like you exist, you're always willing to help. Thanks for this info, I will take note of this when I lodge in my kids' application. YOu're a star"Success is not about how much money you have; it's about the choices you can make in life"
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21st September 2009 #46
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[QUOTE=mmsjr6;173611]the eco,s decision
i have refused your visa application on this occassion through reference to the above paragraphs(s) of the immigration rules . this decision was made on the merits of the application.
the eco,s reasons and supporting evidence
i am not satisfied you meet the paragraph of the rules above
Because:
you have submitted no evidence that your mother has legal custody of you . i addition you have provided no evidence of your fathers current whereabouts or that your mother has had sole responsibilty for your upbringing i am not therefore satisfied that you meet the requirments of paragraph 301(i)(b) of the immigration rules
my daughters application was refused on the same ground apart from NO EVIDENCE OF YOUR FATHER. We provided info of my daughter's father , it didnt help at all ..So really we can't win ehh..you provide whereabouts its wrong you dont provide its wrong
But anyway I've posted my appeal hoping they'll reconsider the application. I will let you know soon as I get an update.If it's not life threatening IGNORE it .. .
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22nd September 2009 #47
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22nd September 2009 #48
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23rd September 2009 #49
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23rd September 2009 #50"what do you mean not overcrowding..sadly he still renting for the moment of a small room on a shared house , confuse if this will do as you see were going to aply or he must find a much bigger house/room... for us all prorior for our aplication. Reading your earlier post I get the impression that you are talking abou a total of 3 children in all. I don't how you will get on with regard to the 2 children who will qualify for British passports, but I think that if you apply for a visa to bring the other child to the UK with you, it's likely that you will be refused, unless your husband can provide suitable accomodation for you all. A small room in a shared house maybe acceptable for your husband and yourself, but the ECO is likely to say that it is not suitable to house children as well. Iain."
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23rd September 2009 #51
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23rd September 2009 #52
EDL - ENGLISH DEFENCE LEAGUE
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/magazine/8250017.stm
I wonder if their ex bnp, maybe they want to look like they've cleaned up their act abit, since they have 2 Euro MP's in the euro parliment now
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23rd September 2009 #53
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hi everyone i would just like to thank everyone who gave us advice with our visa problem with the children and F*@k you to the bnp member above
and i will like to show what has happened with our visa case over the last few days
1st reply from embassy the eco,s decision
i have refused your visa application on this occassion through reference to the above paragraphs(s) of the immigration rules . this decision was made on the merits of the application.
the eco,s reasons and supporting evidence
i am not satisfied you meet the paragraph of the rules above
Because:
you propose to travel to the uk with your mother who has made an application for entry clearance as a spouse . whilst you have submitted an affidavit from your father you have submitted no evidence that your mother has legal custody of you . i addition you have provided no evidence of your fathers current whereabouts or that your mother has had sole responsibilty for your upbringing i am not therefore satisfied that you meet the requirments of paragraph 301(i)(b) of the immigration rules
i therefore refuse your application.
in reaching this decision to refuse your application i have given careful consideration to your qualified right to family and private life under article 8 of the european convention of human rights however i am satisfied that any perceived interference with your right to family life under article 8 is proportionate to the aim of maintaining an effective immigration control and does not therefore breach your convention rights. in addition , i am not satisfied that there are any insurmountable obstacles to your family member travelling to the philippines to enjoy family life with you in this country .
our reply
dear sir/madam
My wife and i have applied for a settlement visa in uk we have been together for 4 years
,and will have have been married for 2 years this coming march my wife has 3 kids from a previous marriage
which was annulled in the philippines courts . Yesterday we got our application back and to our horror my wife
has been granted a settlement visa but not our 3 kids .I am the sole provider for my family how can my wife come to uk and leave the 3 kids there
is this a sick joke by the manila embassy please can we have some advice on how to correct this
yours faithfully
then we sent this
On tuesday we got our deciscion were my wife was giving a visa but our three children were denied
the reason stated for the refusal was .
you propose to travel to the uk with your mother who has made an application for entry clearance as a spouse . whilst you have submitted an affidavit from your father you have submitted no evidence that your mother has legal custody of you . i addition you have provided no evidence of your fathers current whereabouts or that your mother has had sole responsibilty for your upbringing i am not therefore satisfied that you meet the requirments of paragraph 301(i)(b) of the immigration rules .
we processed our application using the check list and were unaware of the need of this information we have now got this information . Fathers address and phone number if the ECO wishes to contact him or his current partner and also a letter from the father stating he has given my wife full custody of the children. The anullment papers that states my wife has custody of children . Letters from school principal stating that she has been the only attending parent to school activitys and receipts for school fees payed by my wife .
The ECO who handled our case was DBrown would it be possible to arrange an appointment with him/her to show them documents that were missing from original application.
were are hoping to avoid a lenghtly appeal process
yours Faithfully
they replied with this on monday
Further to your fax received here on 21st September 2009, I have reviewed the case in light of your correspondence. I acknowledge that you have submitted an affidavit from your ex-husband and copies of part of your annulment hearing. However none of these documents mention that you have been granted sole legal custody of your children. Having carefully reviewed the applications I am satisfied that the original decision was correct and I am not minded to reverse that decision.
so we replied with this on tuesday
please read the paragraph below
it is necessary to satisfy the Home Office that the sponsoring parent has, usually for a substantial period of time, been the chief person exercising parental responsibility for the child. This means that the sponsoring parent has had and still has the ultimate responsibility for the major decisions relating to the child’s upbringing and provides the child with the majority of the financial and emotional support it requires. The sponsoring parent must show that he or she has had, and continues to have, care and control of the child.
I am now at a loss as to what you term as sole legal custody .
according to the paragraph above we have provided you evidence that my wife has had sole responsibility for the children since the ex husband left in 2005 . she still has ultimate responsibility for the major decisions relating to the children's upbringings and provides the children with the complete financial an emotional support
I am therefore confused and angry as to why my children have been denied visas is my wife supposed to come to UK and leave the children there the father was deemed by the Philippines courts as unfit
TEST RESULT AND EVALUATION;
RESPONDENT IS FOUND TO BE LACKING IN MATURE DISPOSITION AND IS TOTALLY UNAWARE OF THE ESSENTIAL REQUISITE EXACTED BY SOCIETY FROM HIM IN ORDER TO FULLFILL HIS OBLIGATIONS BEING A MARRIED MAN . HE IS DEEMED TO BE SUFFERING FROM NARCISSISTIC PERSONALITY DISORDER ( DSM IV -R {AXIS II CLUSTER B 301.81} A CONDITION THAT IS GRAVE INCURABLE AND PATHOLOGICAL SUCH THAT IT DEBILITATES HIM FROM BECOMING AN IDEAL MARITAL PARTNER HIS CHARACTER FLAWS OF INSECURITY ,IMMATURITY SELF CENTEREDNESS,INTERPERSONAL EXPLOITATIVENESS, AND LACK OF EMPATHY DISABLES HIM FROM ASSUMING HIS DUTIES TO PETITIONER BEGGINING BY EARLY ADULTHOOD
According to your reply you deem it acceptable for us to leave our children with this person .I ask would you leave your own children with this Person.
As a member of the British Armed Forces i find it disgusting that i cant bring my family to live in the country i have sworn to serve and protect
I am seriously considering asking the newspapers in the UK if they would be interested in my story of how the British Embassy in Manila denied a member of the British Armed Forces from bringing his family to live in the UK
I am hoping and praying that this matter can be cleared up as we are desperately trying to avoid the appeal process due to my duties as a member of the armed forces
yours faithfully
they replied with this today
Thank you for your fax received here today. Whilst I am satisfied that the decision was correct at the time that it was made, in light of your representations, the decision to refuse the clearances has now been overturned. We are now prepared to issue visas.
You must send the passports to the Embassy within 3 months from the date of this letter at the following address:
MNL 468237/238/239
Visa Services
British Embassy Manila
120 Upper McKinley Road
McKinley Hill
Taguig City 1634
PLEASE ENSURE YOU INCLUDE A PRE-PAID COURIER RETURN ENVELOPE. You can use the following courier companies: LBC / Aboitiz 2GO / JRS Express / DHL Express / Air 21.
Failure to do so will result in your original documents and passport not being returned to you.
NOTE: We can only accept passports for stamping that have been forwarded through a courier.
Yours sincerely
Correspondence Team
Visa Services
UK Border Agency
British Embassy Manila
IT TURNS OUT THE ECOS ARE HUMAN AFTER ALL UNFORTUNATLY THEY HAVE TO FOLLOW GUIDELINES SET DOWN FOR THEM
i hope this give a little bit of inspiration to anyone in the same boat
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23rd September 2009 #54
Ohh thats GREAT Tom, very happy to hear that, well done man!
Jiri & Maricel
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24th September 2009 #55
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24th September 2009 #56
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Excellent result! Congratulations.
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24th September 2009 #57
hi mmsjr6,
see ??? i am really glad your case was overturned. i have the same case but my sols never gave up and i am now brit citizen. don't know if this will be the same case for my kids though. your good news has certainly made my day today. i am really getting so anxious because we got the same case. my two kids' father is nowhere to be found and doesn't want to be found either. dswd has made an effort in finding him when i applied for their travel clearance but to no avail. i guess your effort has trully worked and has been rewarded. you must be on a high when you heard that they are going to overturn their decision. well done and i salute you for standing up for what you truly believe in. i am so happy for you and your family. you deserve it."Success is not about how much money you have; it's about the choices you can make in life"
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25th September 2009 #58
well done
just shows you, don 't take no for an answer, and you dont ask you don't get
you saved yourself time, money and heartache without having to go to an appeal
pretty rare for them to overturn a refusal
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25th September 2009 #59
I don't think so.... well not the one who processed your childrens applications anyway. I think he/she just realised that you were going to make a real fuss about it so he/she just kicked it upstairs and let someone else make a sensible decision about it. I mean, nothing changed after you sent the second letter, so if there had been real issues outstanding with regard to their applications, then he/she would have continued to refuse to grant their visas even after you sent the third letter and he/she would have been absolutely right to do so.
Iain.
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25th September 2009 #60
some cases are not so straight forward, some are borderline, so it's not easy to make a decision.
evidence of sole custody, maybe they realise that not everyone has a court order giving them custody, but then they dont want to be piggy in the middle btw fighting parents, by giving a settlement visa to a child when that parent doesn't have custody.
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