exam results

[les_taxi]

bloody exam results! get em down pit and building railroads proper jobs. years spent partying at uni then hopefully job at matalan!

[bornatbirth]

your just jealous!

[maria_and_matt]

bloody exam results! get em down pit and building railroads proper jobs. years spent partying at uni then hopefully job at matalan!

what is your problem, for us parents exam results are a big deal

[les_taxi]

modern society!

[maria_and_matt]

oh okay, whatever

[scott&ligaya]

Well done to your child, and to you for providing the platform form which they can succeed.

the essence of the problem is the dumbing down of exams to get school pass rates up and therefore better league table places coupled with creating universities from lower level institutions and the explosion of "new" degrees in all manner of ridiculous subjects. A British education used to be sought after, nowadays it is second rate in many areas of the country. Many wealthier Hong Kong locals (where we used to live) valued our education system and used to send their kids to ESF schools and then on to further education in the UK. Now they choose Canada, Australia and China and want the kids receiving IB programme not A or AS levels.

[KeithD]

Worthless exams for business. Labour have the policy of no losers!

[les_taxi]

the number of "uni" students i taxi who can't do simple maths and who's basic english is poor amazes me.now media studies, parties and maybe a huge student debt before applying for shop floor job at matalan! why not start in work straight away and they could be be branch manager in a few years hiring the students lol.

[maria_and_matt]

the number of "uni" students i taxi who can't do simple maths and who's basic english is poor amazes me.now media studies, parties and maybe a huge student debt before applying for shop floor job at matalan! why not start in work straight away and they could be be branch manager in a few years hiring the students lol.

not all uni students end up working in matalan... i want my son to have a good future so we tell him to work hard so he gets somewhere in life. i am so proud of what my son has achieved and i am 100% sure that all his hard work will pay off.

[les_taxi]

not all uni students end up working in matalan... i want my son to have a good future so we tell him to work hard so he gets somewhere in life. i am so proud of what my son has achieved and i am 100% sure that all his hard work will pay off.

yes i agree with you but i can't help thinking that the system is at fault and i hope your sons hard work does pay off

[joebloggs]

the number of "uni" students i taxi who can't do simple maths and who's basic english is poor amazes me.now media studies, parties and maybe a huge student debt before applying for shop floor job at matalan! why not start in work straight away and they could be be branch manager in a few years hiring the students lol.

my misses is at maths, but shes managed to get 2 degrees without the need for maths thou i wish she had taken one in common sense to

i think you're a bit jelly les they don t give you A's for just spelling your name right on the exam paper .................. i think you get a B for that

[KeithD]

Why debt anyway? The charges have been in place long enough for the parents to have saved up for their kids further eduaction!

[maria_and_matt]

Why debt anyway? The charges have been in place long enough for the parents to have saved up for their kids further eduaction!

yep, my sons child benefit and money given to him om bdays and xmases.. and we put a little each month to go towards his uni fees...

[Matt7]

I don't have a problem with exam results. Having been a product of the system, its not the kids fault for knowing the answers.....its the school and governments fault

Its the governments fault for setting the wrong targets for schools, and its the schools fault for being so wrapped up in the crappy government targets they only care about getting the kids to pass, as opposed to giving them a proper, well rounded education

Old people need to realise this

[KeithD]

Old people need to realise this

[bornatbirth]

Old people need to realise this

any one over the age of 23 is old?

before you know you will be older too!

[Matt7]

any one over the age of 23 is old?

before you know you will be older too!

I never said that

But the older a person gets, the more they moan about how much easier exams are getting. Its almost a perfect science

[KeithD]

..... the more they moan about how much easier exams are getting. Its almost a perfect science

Not quite true.

The FACT exams have got easier has been proven numerous times by an number of independent institutions.

One simple instance is that the University exam to get in has not changed for decades, and yet a large % of A students now fail them.

Another example, students from pre-Labour were given the GCSE paper, while those from today were given the equivalent O Level paper. The GCSE takers all past with an A, the O Level's all failed. They run this test on different people over different subjects.

Before the mid 90's we used to be taught in school the subjects we had taken, now they are taught how to pass an exam. In fact, in some subjects now you get a pass without even taking an exam. ....and 50% of the exam is already complete before they take the paper, that result is decided by the teacher, and strangely they all pass!

[somebody]

Not quite true.

The FACT exams have got easier has been proven numerous times by an number of independent institutions.

One simple instance is that the University exam to get in has not changed for decades, and yet a large % of A students now fail them.

Another example, students from pre-Labour were given the GCSE paper, while those from today were given the equivalent O Level paper. The GCSE takers all past with an A, the O Level's all failed. They run this test on different people over different subjects.

Before the mid 90's we used to be taught in school the subjects we had taken, now they are taught how to pass an exam. In fact, in some subjects now you get a pass without even taking an exam. ....and 50% of the exam is already complete before they take the paper, that result is decided by the teacher, and strangely they all pass!

Word GCses were introducded a year or two before i got to the stage of taking them. Back then most of the experienced teachers taught the same way they did the o levels etc. Learn about the subject the course work was relevant. Many of these teachers who we all respected left the teaching game over the next few years.

Having been in many educational organsations from primary to universitys its all about figures and upward trends blah blah.

Many youngsters are still good candidates to be taking on but we at my firm have no faith in the results at all levels and IB seem to be just as effy we have noticed as an indicator of talent. We now test extensively all candidates in many ways. Many with high levels of results are found to be not what we require while those with what looks bad on paper actualy have decent basic 3 r's skills, common sense, able to think logically, good skills and knowledge on the subjects of intrest to us.

So dont write off your kids if they dont get lots of A's but if they do get high marks do try and make sure its not because they get on with their teachers and the System works for them.

We also aim all our CV's as evidence of what people have done so if your kids may not be the best in the classroom. Get them lots of practical hands on experience. If they want to go in to IT or office work ECDL or ms , and IT qualifcations like A+ N+ and MCp's etc.

Volunteer work, scouts, red cross volunteers, take part in sports and possibly help organise them, working in a shop or other business as a saturday worker all show the candidate may have real world skills.

A person who can run a football club/ church days organise trips away, attend a job in a charity workplace (get their on time, work hard and make a difference) would score more highly than a person with a A in media studies.

We look for these example on CV's of people who may have leadership skils, able to work with people in a team, people who can organise themsleves or others. Those who want to learn, Of course those who wish to work and likely to have a good attendance no point in being a world expert in a subject if they are forever late and not at work.

[joebloggs]

any one over the age of 23 is old?

before you know you will be older too!

he's already 1/3 of the away into being 6ft under

[aromulus]

Old people need to realise this

Don't worry lad, you will grow out of youth.

[Peanutz]

Definitely agree with you Andy.

A degree will not make you desirable to be hired. Who analyse your CV will look at your experience and skills and most importantly 'Attitude'.
These are the key things that will give you a chance to be hired.

[joebloggs]

Thats the point we need more Apprenticeships and vocational course. Degrees are needed but not 60-70 percent of the nations students surely?

As I mentioned before when i'm involved in employing people from trainnees to highly specialised IT experts. Im not intrested in if they can pass an exam, I want to know what they retain from it, what skills they have. Could they manage people, can they manage themsleves.

We had Electronic engineers with a bsc after their name who couldn't use test equipment, unable solder or perform hands on work in general! Compuer science gradutes who can't code the list could go on.

Definitely agree with you Andy.

A degree will not make you desirable to be hired. Who analyse your CV will look at your experience and skills and most importantly 'Attitude'.
These are the key things that will give you a chance to be hired.

60-70% of the pop , as my sister would say' what planet are you on ?'
i think only 1/3 of the pop ever go to uni, and i bet, like in everything else, were at the bottom of any euro tables on the % of pop who attended uni.

your not interested if they have or can pass an exam , so you would let someone who can manage others or themselves touch your customers server and at best they've installed windows xp at home , over someone who has a mcse or even a IT degree , at least they have an idea what a bit, nibble and byte is

as for engs and computer grads, who couldn't code or use test equipment, you cannot expect them to know every bit of equipment out there, or code in every language under the sun straight away.

attitude is nothing compared to experience and qualification, being able to do the job correctly is what's important not being able to blag about it.

sure we need more apprenticeships, but we need more working class kids going to uni, it shouldn't be a right for just the well off, it should be a right for everyone who is capable.

[somebody]

60-70% of the pop , as my sister would say' what planet are you on ?'
i think only 1/3 of the pop ever go to uni, and i bet, like in everything else, were at the bottom of any euro tables on the % of pop who attended uni.

your not interested if they have or can pass an exam , so you would let someone who can manage others or themselves touch your customers server and at best they've installed windows xp at home , over someone who has a mcse or even a IT degree , at least they have an idea what a bit, nibble and byte is

as for engs and computer grads, who couldn't code or use test equipment, you cannot expect them to know every bit of equipment out there, or code in every language under the sun straight away.

attitude is nothing compared to experience and qualification, being able to do the job correctly is what's important not being able to blag about it.

sure we need more apprenticeships, but we need more working class kids going to uni, it shouldn't be a right for just the well off, it should be a right for everyone who is capable.

Just wrote out a long reply and it dissapeared as something about me beign logged in already. Anyways will give u in a nutshell a response.

Tony Bliar in 2006 wanted 50 percent and at the moment all schools education authorties want to push there pupils in to uni. They dont care what they do there but it looks good for next years figures.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/ed...ce-415761.html


This passage from the above page was of intrest.

The UK was well below Australia, the Czech Republic, Greece, Hungary, Ireland, Korea, Mexico, Poland, Portugal, Slovakia and Sweden, whose figures rose between 33 per cent and 169 per cent over the same period.

Mr Schleicher said most of the these countries had a strong vocational strand of education - along the lines recommended by the inquiry into 14 to 19 education by the former chief schools inspector Sir Mike Tomlinson but rejected by Mr Blair.

The Prime Minister had been worried before the last election that replacing A-levels and GCSE with an overarching diploma covering both academic and vocational qualifications would be seized on by the Conservatives as evidence he was scrapping the "gold standard" of education.


Ie because of Bliars (its suposed to be that way round) pride Pupils suffer as we must get more uni students
Hes a link i found not sure of the underlying message of the website but the bullet points made sense to me

http://www.economicshelp.org/2007/10...niversity.html

Many of those we test who cant give examples of their work, or dont seem to outside of the classroom use there computing skills seem to fail our own tests during the interview process. We all know paper mcse certs holders etc.

Grr i wrote pages and pages and dont have the time to replicate.

Maybe another day but i do know some pupils i work with its just a waste of time them going to uni to do a degree any degree while others should go at all costs even when its a hardship for the family.

But to many will get no benefit and fail possibly they will attempt another degree and have a huge gap or two faillures on their cv which employers notice and from friedns experience this really affects their chances and of course they have all the debt and none of the benefits. Many friends are still recovering ten years later and have not started pension funds while young as they had to catch up on the other debts

I totally agree uni should be avaiable to those who really need it at from any background not just the upper classes

But the silly herding people into uni to do a degree any degree for figures is downright evil on the poor pupil who may suffer for theit entire life.

Oh ps the test equipment in question with several of these new workers was a multimeter any electronic engineer should be abale to measure current and voltage surely. On the language tip yes not all lanuages but the ones they claim to be qualififed in would help

[joebloggs]

We all know paper mcse certs holders etc.

I think them days are well gone Andy, i think they ended around 2000 when Ms changed to adaptive testing. cannot just download the questions and answers like in the days of mcse nt4

but at least a mcse is more useful than a degree if your applying for a job in IT support etc.

Andy this country does NVQ's, there are many here studying them, filipinos coming to the UK to do NVQ's, and you know its being abused as cheap labour and illegal working by dodgy colleges above your local take away.

sure the gov should use a combination of nvq's, apprenticeships and uni degrees to educate the school leavers, but i don't think its up to the gov to tell you what you can or can't do. equal opportunities for all, but i don't think all kids would want to go to uni, many want out of school and start earning some money, and yes, don't forget these school leavers will have to pay your pension, so you should want the best for them

[RickyR]

Just to clarify, I'm not against a university education. As 'Somebody' said, it's all about what degree is being studied, what it is worth and how will it be used. But doing a degree in History just for the sake of having a degree, isn't a good enough reason to justify 4 years and tens of the thousands of pounds.
I'm not suggesting for a moment that everyone take a career at sea, its worked for me and just to mention that unlike Filipino Seafarers I normally work 1 month on / 1 month off (Filipino working conditions unfortunately are still catching up) which enables a lot of quality time with my family.

I think encouraging and supporting careers as Electricians, Plumbers and any other trade should be encouraged in schools. Taking an apprenticeship shouldn't be looked down up on. Unfortunately the focus in schools is that everyone should do the same, and there seems to be a strong focus on people becoming IT programmers or business management.

Then again in IT, as has been mentioned earlier, the best programmers I have met are people who knew C++ and Visual Basic at 14 years old, and were working in IT at 18 having never been to Uni. On the flip side, I've met people who have done degrees in IT and can write software which looks fine, but has to debugged by someone who actually understands the code. I'm not saying that a degree in IT isn't the way forward, but it isn't the answer in every case.

The Education system needs changes, but will that happen?

[somebody]

I think them days are well gone Andy, i think they ended around 2000 when Ms changed to adaptive testing. cannot just download the questions and answers like in the days of mcse nt4

but at least a mcse is more useful than a degree if your applying for a job in IT support etc.

Andy this country does NVQ's, there are many here studying them, filipinos coming to the UK to do NVQ's, and you know its being abused as cheap labour and illegal working by dodgy colleges above your local take away.

sure the gov should use a combination of nvq's, apprenticeships and uni degrees to educate the school leavers, but i don't think its up to the gov to tell you what you can or can't do. equal opportunities for all, but i don't think all kids would want to go to uni, many want out of school and start earning some money, and yes, don't forget these school leavers will have to pay your pension, so you should want the best for them

Nope plenty of people brain dumping still Mate trust me. Still have drones who come off boot camps with no prectical experience think all we want is someone who has crammed and passed an exam or two. Adaptive makes it tougher but not impossible to be coacheed though them.


Regarding the younger generation doing well

Exactly I want them to do well and the forcing people into schemes to fix targets take them off the dole or what have yuou really bugs me.

I know there are NVq's and plenty of other options other than the typical degree which will never suit all but way to many pupils are pressured into them.
The goverment shouldn't tell you what to do but it does seem pressure and spin is put on various levels of the education system for headlines

As well the school leaver possibly paying my state pension like me they should have there own one or some form of savings from early age.Are you aware of the huge issue of student loans, seen way to many people still burdened with the debt years later and often they didn't get a result which made the pain worth it. This are the ones who often have to put off saving in a pension scheme. They will burden the country far more surely?

Many who started the schemes when trainees or college leavers now i know have a decent pension pot sometimes very decent one as their wages have gone up and many are now self employed or owners of Business Employing others They also didn't waste huge amounts of goverment money in attempting to keep up with the joneses or ensure schools sent enough pupils off to uni

We have trainee Field engineers in another department they have degree holders in there and plenty who just went to college or straight from school. From the three different groups there is no particular pattern from what I can see.

The company wants people with a good attitude, mechnical and electrical know how. But mostly they want them to be trained up in the way they want them to work.

Now I know after a few years many are on 25-30k plus then of course regional allowances and good benefits. Chance of progression blah blah
So what is the point if a Pupil ask the careers advisor ( i remeber asking one "helping " me while at school what she had doen in the past a lot of mumbling happened ) who says oh yeah but look with your grades you may just clear at a uni in this degree not a popular uni or not many takers for the course "but your have a degree" Go on try it, even if its for the experience

So the pupil goes off changes course to media studies as they offered him a place after a year as not for him eventually passes the course but nothing special and needs a job. Theres a recession on the public services no longer require people with a degree any degree.
So the pupil relies at their school qualfications which were technolgy based and gets on a trainee scheme. They find themsleves selected due to doing well in the assements. They get a trainee pay rate which means they can pay off the student loan but not great.
A friend at school joined the trainee scheme at 18 now is fully qualified and earning a decent wage no debt imposed on them and able to bulid there life much quicker. Due to starting earlier in the career they pick up things quickly ready to adapt not set in there ways. Move on to managment.

The orignal pupil four/five years older and of course he has a degree much wiser doesn't find it so easy to pick up things or be told what to do. He has a degree those supervising/mentoring him for example his old class mate dont.

Do I know of examples of this maybe not people from the same school but plenty of Engineers in our company who are doing ok wish they had not been advised when they knew there path go on get a degree it will make you a better person.

[KeithD]

Are any Uni's doing degrees in gang bangs, oral sex, prostitution (or does that come under business studies)?

[aromulus]

Are any Uni's doing degrees in gang bangs, oral sex, prostitution (or does that come under business studies)?

I am not quite sure, but I know for a fact that some uni's are giving courses on "Victoria and David Beckam"...

Pretty much the same I reckon......

[KeithD]

Always write long posts in Notepad.