identity crisis

[sam_althea]

last night, some insecure people here in belfast wrote something on the fence nearby Asda...it is written this way...."BLACK AND CHINESE" GO HOME!!!..
thank God we are Filipinos...but anyway, that is descrimination....poor people, they dont realize our contributions in this country..

[joebloggs]

i was sat near the front of a bus going home from work on Friday, a couple of seats in front of me was a lady with her 4 kids, a baby, the others maybe 4,7 and 12. they were laughing at something outside, and they started talking to each other, then i realised they were polish.

maybe 5 mins later, someone sat near the back of the bus said, 'polish' .. few mins later another said 'go home' then the first one said ' look they don't know what were saying' and they kept saying 'polish' and the other 'go home', if i could hear them, then the polish sure did, but they just kept laughing about something, this went on for a few mins..

i was really close to saying something, but most of the people sat behind me were college students. and without knowing which little it was, i wasn't going to tell anyone to shut up without knowing which it was.. . but no one else, none of their friends or anyone else who was sat behind me said anything to these 2 smart .

i would have said something if i had a camera phone and took pics of the 2 little , and tried to get them expelled from college or report it to the police, but like i said they only said 'polish' and the other 'go home'. but even still i felt really uncomfortable witnessing this, picking on a woman and kids, pathetic little . i know they wouldn't have said anything if a polish guy was there, they would have wet their pants.

but what me off, no one who was sat next to them or near them said anything..

[chris40]

yes ,i find any intolerant idiotic racist behaviour infuriating too. even if these cretins you mention have been born and raised as idiots surrounded by people with bigoted beleifs ,at the age you attend college they should know their beleifs will cause offence to the majority of people.
so there is no excuse for it.

[joebloggs]

oh i forgot to add, a pensioner couple were sat behind me, and the woman said to her husband, "their noisy" and her husband sighed and said " their polish"

coming from old people who should know better

i'm no fan of uncontrolled immigration, but i would never abuse a foreigner, especially women and kids

[KeithD]

Maybe the 'whites' should go home from the USA as well....and the 'whites' from Australia......all back to the motherland....Britain!!!!!!! May as well level the Yin & Yang if we are sending folk 'home'!!!!

[aromulus]

This is, and always will be, a very controversial issue to talk about.

All it is in my mind pure and simple ignorance of the unknown.
Lots of people instead of finding out more about other cultures, prefer to hide in their own little cocoons, where they feel safe.

Joe, I don't blame the kids for saying ad nauseam "polish" and "go home", I put the blame on the parents.
I had an instance here with Jet, for which I am not very happy about, and soon I will have to mention something to the little d's (single) mother.

Unfortunately, while the door to mass immigration is kept open, we will see more and more insecure people cause trouble because they don't understand what's really going on.
People with lower IQ like that, will be easy pray for recruitment into the BNP.

I am not saying that Stoke's citizenry are thicko's, but it seems that at the last council elections they managed to vote 3 BNP in.... At this rate I can see a huge shift in that direction, with maybe 2/3 MP's at the next general elections.
http://www.stoke.gov.uk/ccm/cms-serv...set_id=1591940

Scary......

[benb]

last night, some insecure people here in belfast wrote something on the fence nearby Asda...it is written this way...."BLACK AND CHINESE" GO HOME!!!..
thank God we are Filipinos...but anyway, that is descrimination....poor people, they dont realize our contributions in this country..

For many locals, its not easy for them to differentiate a chinese, japanese, thai, filipino etc. They all look the same.

but what me off, no one who was sat next to them or near them said anything..

Many are concerned with their own problems especially with a gloomy economy.

[aromulus]

For many locals, its not easy for them to differentiate a chinese, japanese, thai, filipino etc. They all look the same.



Many are concerned with their own problems especially with a gloomy economy.

With all due respect.....

Sounds like you are excusing them....

Appeasement gave us WWII.... Which in my mind is the root cause of what is going wrong nowadays....

[joebloggs]

education dom is the only answer

little do kids/teenagers know of their own countries history, without the polish pilots in the RAF, Britain may not have won 'the battle of Britain' and maybe we would all be speaking german now , like my mom was forced to learn German at school when the Nazi's invaded the Baltic states in WW2.

i can understand the point that people are worried that eastern europeans have taken jobs etc, near me, there must be 5 polish sklep shops i go past on my way to work, maybe too many here, too soon, and with the credit crunch its not a good time for all, but no reason to abuse women and kids

[IainBusby]

education dom is the only answer

little do kids/teenagers know of their own countries history, without the polish pilots in the RAF, Britain may not have won 'the battle of Britain' and maybe we would all be speaking german now , like my mom was forced to learn German at school when the Nazi's invaded the Baltic states in WW2.

i can understand the point that people are worried that eastern europeans have taken jobs etc, near me, there must be 5 polish sklep shops i go past on my way to work, maybe too many here, too soon, and with the credit crunch its not a good time for all, but no reason to abuse women and kids

That's the real problem, too many, too soon. I'm not against immigration or immigrants from any country in the world, but if the immigrants that come here, all come in a huge wave over a very short period, they do not assimilate into the British way of life, our ways and our customs. They just congregate together, usually, but not always, in inner city areas and create their own little ghettos like the Polish in Peterborough etc.

Apart from when all of the Asians were kicked out of Uganda, I can't remember this ever happening before until now and although we have always had those who were against immigrants of any nationality, in the past, immigrants were mostly welcomed here in the UK.
Iain.

[benb]

With all due respect.....

Sounds like you are excusing them....

Its true facts. But no excuse at all!
Being a British Indian, I know how it feels to be discriminated.

Cheers

[benb]

they do not assimilate into the British way of life, our ways and our customs. They just congregate together, usually, but not always, in inner city areas and create their own little ghettos like the Polish in Peterborough etc.

I'm against congregation too - religion plays a part to some extent.

Britian can either be strict in terms of immigration (like in Singapore, Kuwait etc), which is unlikely to happen or we all just have to adapt and create a common way of life.

As Joe mentioned, I also think education is the key!

[andypaul]

education dom is the only answer

little do kids/teenagers know of their own countries history, without the polish pilots in the RAF, Britain may not have won 'the battle of Britain' and maybe we would all be speaking german now , like my mom was forced to learn German at school when the Nazi's invaded the Baltic states in WW2.

i can understand the point that people are worried that eastern europeans have taken jobs etc, near me, there must be 5 polish sklep shops i go past on my way to work, maybe too many here, too soon, and with the credit crunch its not a good time for all, but no reason to abuse women and kids

Polish and Engima machines is all you need to know to why the British ended up on the right side of the war.

Never right to be rude to anyone. But the problems were planted in the early noughties and before with everyone to scared to talk about the Issue.

One of the Worse issues your find is how racist/bigoted many Immigrants are which is also part of the reason as well as the common bond/vaules/religion/outlook etc they share. Means they end up with their own..

Sadly many of the Poles I see in West London have very very non pc views. From what both the more highly educated Poles who came over in recently and from those who have been living here years tell me. Many of the working class newcomer poles hold views which if expressed on here would have the board closed down. I can think of several violent epsiodes and many where the match didn't quite light with drunk poles acting like the polish version of the BNP. I have witnessed these with my own eyes and in the company of Polish friends who were embrassed to tell me its not unknown.

Many other races from all backgrounds will say in public how they have no issues with others but a very very large percentage will have different racial,ethnic, religous and political groups that they would prefer to stay away from. Right on social workers will not be able to intergrate these groups how ever many seminars they attend.

The best way is to get by it would seem is to agree to disagree and see how things pan out. Many cultures as they group better off tend to find it easier to "intergrate" but thats not going to happen for the next three years minimum.
If the worse possible outcomes happen from the information being fed to me comes to light we will all revert back to large groups for survial of the fittest.

Fights between the different cultures and races have been a big issue in London for years of course but I have heard and seen more divisons breding in the last six months for a long time.

Casual/cash in hand work which kept many of the people who live at the bottom of the pile afloat has dried up. Crime is up but not that we know as its easier to rob from those who will not report it to the authorities so quickly as the middle class and the rich.

At the schools and academies i have links with in central london with many being from poor backgrounds this is a big issue with Pupils being robbed of items they need for schooling or dissapearing as the family cant afford to send them. The onsite Police officers know its happening but rarely get a formal complaint raised.

Again in local areas the big problems not between White british kids and "others" its between various ethnic minority groups. The biggest issues between established groups and those recently arrived in the area/UK.
Both types of groups often police themselves from my experience having rightly or wrongly a distrust of police forces in general formed often from past experinces in there homelands.

I think it was the early noughties when there were the race riots, Friends and I were waiting for it to kick off in West london. but it never did mainly it would seem that people were doing ok. Had Jobs, credit was easy, there house was on the up, rents cheap and the pound strong.

A credit drought, a recession, house prices going back down to what they should be and possibly lower with the issue that affects many on here remittance.
With Sterling looking like its the weakest currency major currency and now its last big industry the city is deeply wounded(ok we have education bringing in the currency at present but how long will that last?). We will see major problems for those with those who remittance affects greatly. Not just in the pocket but pride and self esteem. no one can for sure say how this will impact British soceity but i doubt it will be a postive.

Its gonna get ugly out there

[joebloggs]

yes i think things could get nasty for some of the eastern euros who are here, i've worked with some polish, like i've said b4, one i got to know really well. was a decent guy. but as work took on more eastern euros, i started hearing resentment from other people i worked with, saying what they doing here, taking our jobs, from all ages, from mid 20's to a guy who was nearly 60, which surprised me as i had know him for many years and he was always easy going.

i get a bus to work in the morning and 12 polish get off one bus to wait for another bus at my stop, 2 more polish get on the same bus as me, makes you wonder how many polish are here, and what effect it will have when brits start losing their jobs and are unable to find work .

[andypaul]

yes i think things could get nasty for some of the eastern euros who are here, i've worked with some polish, like i've said b4, one i got to know really well. was a decent guy. but as work took on more eastern euros, i started hearing resentment from other people i worked with, saying what they doing here, taking our jobs, from all ages, from mid 20's to a guy who was nearly 60, which surprised me as i had know him for many years and he was always easy going.

i get a bus to work in the morning and 12 polish get off one bus to wait for another bus at my stop, 2 more polish get on the same bus as me, makes you wonder how many polish are here, and what effect it will have when brits start losing their jobs and are unable to find work .

Its not just polish workers.

For example in London many of the cleaning companies are it seems latino (mainly south american from the few convos with a smattering of portugese and spanish workers as well) Untill recently no one else wanted the jobs so it was the lowest of the lows. But now i notice British people (of all colours) are now not a rare sight. The same in supermarkets and even in factorys.

When the underclass and the migrant workforce get squeezed where do they go?
Already in Victoria particularly and other parts of central London there are dozens if not hundreds of Eastern european rough sleepers, also people from other races and an increase in British (again of various colours).
Check out the queues in Rochester row when your next down in the SW1 area joe huge queues for the shelter down there.

Many of the non european black market workers, i doubt are here legally and so will slip in to a tiwllight zone on the streets. Who will police them and look after there basic needs (remeber these people are often duped into being here and never wanted to be a burden on the country just earn a decnt wage)

Regardless of poltical party both would have done the same, hundreds of thousands (they think no one is sure) came here in the good times fair doo's i would most likely do the same. But no one seems to know how we will deal with the problem as we know now not if but when a bust situation comes as it invariably will as history will tell you for hundreds if not thousands of years.

Communties are going to become more insular and look after one another and all the respect and learning about cultures is not going to help in the short term (we should never stop doing the two things thou). Radical ideas and steps need to be created by the mainstream and quickly to stop potentially nasty situations occuring.
Otherwise normally barely tolerate groups such as the BNP, other extreme racial and religous groups will step in.

[joebloggs]

yes your right andy

gov really up by not putting a cap on the eastern europeans coming here, like some countries did, as they have now done for Romanians and Bulgarians. who in their right mind came up with the figure of a few 10k's of polish coming here, when in fact it was near the 1 million mark

and the cap on romainians and bulgarians is only for 7yrs, then they will come in their 100,000's, and why not, who wants to live in a poor country

maybe with the increase in minimum wage, more brits are prepared to do cleaning jobs, when you've got bills to pay most people will do any job to bring money in..

also some central/south American countries you don't need a visa to come to the uk, maybe that's why you see so many of them working here, but with the fines employers could face now for employing illegal immigrants, that also could be another reason why your seeing more Brits doing them jobs.

[PeterB]

Maybe the 'whites' should go home from the USA as well....

It always annoys me, when entering the USA, that in immigration I have to join the queue marked 'aliens'. It's odd that I see many white, quite a few black, but no red skins amongst the immigration officials.

[Scouse]

Most immigrants only come here for a better life and to send money home for their family. Look at all the OFWs all over the world.

As for people congregating together with their own compatriots, that's no different from thousands of British people in Spain who live in little enclaves, eat only 'British' food and don't speak any of the local language.

THe only way to stop people wanting toleave their own country is to make it more attractive to stay. How many time have you read on this forum how hard it is to be apart from a loved one? That's how many people from overseas feel in this country and their families at home.

Think about the hypocrosy of the free movement of capital (and where that has landed us) and the controls on the movement of labour. The rich can move their capital to take advantage of cheaper labour/raw materials/fewer employment rights for workers but labour can't move to take advantage of better conditions and pay.

THe ruling class want us to be divided so they can keep us down. The sooner we all realise that the better for all of us.

[andypaul]

Most immigrants only come here for a better life and to send money home for their family. Look at all the OFWs all over the world.

As for people congregating together with their own compatriots, that's no different from thousands of British people in Spain who live in little enclaves, eat only 'British' food and don't speak any of the local language.

THe only way to stop people wanting toleave their own country is to make it more attractive to stay. How many time have you read on this forum how hard it is to be apart from a loved one? That's how many people from overseas feel in this country and their families at home.

Think about the hypocrosy of the free movement of capital (and where that has landed us) and the controls on the movement of labour. The rich can move their capital to take advantage of cheaper labour/raw materials/fewer employment rights for workers but labour can't move to take advantage of better conditions and pay.

THe ruling class want us to be divided so they can keep us down. The sooner we all realise that the better for all of us.

Well put.

But people have shyed away from the issue and its actually affecting everyone.

Like you say many people who come here to work experince the UK and then bugger off home or somewhere else.
But due to overcomplex rules and what not many of these people fall into poverty traps and end u stuck here in basically ghettos.

Those with no support netork to fall back on will suffer in this recession. Which is why people as well as for company and things in common stick with their own.
But for those with no access to a good support network and little knowledge of the services/rights avaiable to them fall in to poverty on the streets.

In London i know for sure many of the Rough sleepers i see with my own eyes are recent arrivals to the country. As well as i might say a scary amount of older Brits

To disscuss the issue would help all i feel. Not allowing the subject to be dicussed allows those with harmful agendas to make themselves be heard.

[Scouse]

To disscuss the issue would help all i feel. Not allowing the subject to be dicussed allows those with harmful agendas to make themselves be heard.

It needs to be discussed. The rise of the BNP and thier ilk is frightening. Their support is based on ignorance (in the true sense of the word).

We beat them in the seventies and we will do it again.

I have often challenged people when they come out with racist remarks. The funniest was a gay man in work who was bemoaning the fact that the council was slow in processing his claim for rent allowance and he came out with the old chestnut 'if I was an immigrant they would give me everything'

I pointed out that perhaps a a member of a persecuted minority he may like to think about how another persecuted minority would feel, ie immigrants.

He just mumbled and walked away.

[andypaul]

It needs to be discussed. The rise of the BNP and thier ilk is frightening. Their support is based on ignorance (in the true sense of the word).

We beat them in the seventies and we will do it again.

I have often challenged people when they come out with racist remarks. The funniest was a gay man in work who was bemoaning the fact that the council was slow in processing his claim for rent allowance and he came out with the old chestnut 'if I was an immigrant they would give me everything'

I pointed out that perhaps a a member of a persecuted minority he may like to think about how another persecuted minority would feel, ie immigrants.

He just mumbled and walked away.

The BNP and their ilk are not the only ones who concern me.

Radical religous group of all persuassions and im sure other groups with a dodgy agenda will be concoted to take advantage of the issue.

Which will have got worse particulalrly in London when all the big London Councils will not be able to care for those suffering hardship

Remeber if people cant get help in London they will move to other areas to try and get help. Which will burden other smaller councills.