The real reason why the Philippines is poor…

[walesrob]

So they have electric in Wales. When did this happen

Last Tuesday...its great, we do all sorts of stuff, we have lights, we can watch the TV, even microwave some food..

[KeithD]

So they have electric in Wales. When did this happen

When Rob started peddling.......and not drugs (Although I've heard rumours aspirin has reached Aberpratwith)

[andypaul]

When Rob started peddling.......and not drugs (Although I've heard rumours aspirin has reached Aberpratwith)

The people in averheadachewyth need it more, hopefully the sheep drawn ommibus will bring it to them soon.

Gotta go now and sew some more pearls on my suit

[walesrob]

When Rob started peddling.......and not drugs (Although I've heard rumours aspirin has reached Aberpratwith)

What has made me laugh is that none of you can spell Aberystwyth properly

[jimeve]

What has made me laugh is that none of you can spell Aberystwyth properly

Don't know how to pronounce it ,never mind spell it... A ber ca drab er.

[andypaul]

What has made me laugh is that none of you can spell Aberystwyth properly

spelling is one thing, saying it with out spiting over everyone nearby is another thing

Well at least it is for most welsh words

[eljean]

If you think you are unhappy, look at them
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If you think your salary is low, how about her?
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If you think you don't have many friends...
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When you feel like giving up, think of this man
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If you complain about your transport system, how about them?
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If you think you suffer in life, do you suffer as much as he does?
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If your society is unfair to you, how about her?
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Enjoy life how it is and as it comes

Things are worse for others and is a lot better for us J





There are many things in your life that will catch your eye
but only a few will catch your heart....pursue those...


This needs to circulate forever...:

[KeithD]

What has made me laugh is that none of you can spell Rabbie-Dim-Wit

Nor can you

[Paul_London]

We are poor because we lack the correct attitude. We lack the will to comply with and teach these functional principles of rich & developed societies.

If you do not forward this message nothing will happen to you. Your pet will not die, you will not be fired, you will not have bad luck for seven years, and also, you will not get sick or go hungry.

But those may happen because of your lack of discipline & laziness
your love for intrigue and politics, your indifference to saving for the future, your stubborn attitude.

It has little to do with attitude. To become a richer nation you need mass industrialisation. That much is clear. China and India are currently going through this process and their economies are growing. Combined with this you need to your protect your essential industries of national importance through tariffs etc . Every current rich developed nation did this and that is how they got rich.

So the next question is: why hasn't the Philippines done it? Well the will is there. The problem is that the already developed rich nations want to use developing nations like the Philippines as a source of cheap raw materials, goods and labour. If the Philippines went through mass industrialisation, this would be bad news for them because there goes a source of cheap.... everything. So what do they do? See the IMF or World Bank. They offer loans to struggling governments in developing nations BUT ONLY if they open up their economies, ie do not protect infant industry.

So the (no doubt unpopular answer!) to this question is: western inference. The west needs to butt out of developing nations affairs and let them determine their own course.

[andypaul]

It has little to do with attitude. To become a richer nation you need mass industrialisation. That much is clear. China and India are currently going through this process and their economies are growing. Combined with this you need to your protect your essential industries of national importance through tariffs etc . Every current rich developed nation did this and that is how they got rich.

So the next question is: why hasn't the Philippines done it? Well the will is there. The problem is that the already developed rich nations want to use developing nations like the Philippines as a source of cheap raw materials, goods and labour. If the Philippines went through mass industrialisation, this would be bad news for them because there goes a source of cheap.... everything. So what do they do? See the IMF or World Bank. They offer loans to struggling governments in developing nations BUT ONLY if they open up their economies, ie do not protect infant industry.

So the (no doubt unpopular answer!) to this question is: western inference. The west needs to butt out of developing nations affairs and let them determine their own course.

Mass industrailisation may bring wealth so might resources and the sale of them.
Who is to say being in the industrailised world is a good thing. It destroys the old culture with people needing to be group together. Just look at the Uk the first country to be industrailsed. Towns grew far bigger others disapeared or at least never kept up. Families were split up and moved all over the country. Health was affected.

If you asked many of the working class people in England at the time many im sure prefered the older poorer non industrialised days. Dont forget to clear the land in the pursuit of this aim people ended up in the four corners of the world even Liverpool

Many of the countries who will avoid the worst aspects of the money meltdown are those countries who are not so industrailsed and can to a degree survie on a day to day way as a small unit. Ie grow or trade enough food and live with out to many creature comforts.

[Paul_London]

If you asked many of the working class people in England at the time many im sure prefered the older poorer non industrialised days. Dont forget to clear the land in the pursuit of this aim people ended up in the four corners of the world even Liverpool

You're absolutely right. The life of a worker in early industrial Britain was pretty crap. Much like the situation now in sweatshops in China etc - but it didn't last. They got together and won better working conditions, pay, health and safety, the 8 hour day etc. This was replicated in other industrial nations.

Now, none of us would really chose to go back to pre-industrial times. You only have to look at the difference in life expectancy between developed and developing nations for one example of why having a modern industrial society is better. And certainly it is also reflected in the huge historical mass migrations to the west in search of what is perceived to a better life (although I agree, I do wonder sometimes about that suppose better life? ).

[fred]

Makes me laugh when I hear people say..What about our natural resources??
The Philippines has more than a Trillion $$ of them right there beneath their feet.
They had a huge chance to dig a lot of it up 2 years ago when metal prices were at record highs and the Chinese were begging for it..
Foreign investment was begging to help them dig it up for them..Some even tried to overcome the burdensome process and reams of red tape in a bid for local permits etc etc etc..
Some of them are still there waiting and a few are even producing (on Temporary permits that they applied for 4 years ago)..
All at a loss now Im afraid.
Too late..
The resource bull market has finished and no longer worth a damn..

[fred]

i would rather want america to take over on the PI then i believe there will be changes for every filipino anyway, we owe our independence to them....

I thought that many Filipino`s had to die to be liberated from them?

[IainBusby]

Makes me laugh when I hear people say..What about our natural resources??
The Philippines has more than a Trillion $$ of them right there beneath their feet.
They had a huge chance to dig a lot of it up 2 years ago when metal prices were at record highs and the Chinese were begging for it..
Foreign investment was begging to help them dig it up for them..Some even tried to overcome the burdensome process and reams of red tape in a bid for local permits etc etc etc..
Some of them are still there waiting and a few are even producing (on Temporary permits that they applied for 4 years ago)..
All at a loss now Im afraid.
Too late..
The resource bull market has finished and no longer worth a damn..

The systemic corruption which is ingrained in Philippine government, both national and local, means there are far 2 many palms to grease and if you miss one out and someone doesn't get their bung, then the paperwork just gathers dust on a desk somewhere.

Anyone who's been there must have seen examples of what can only be called red tape tied up in more red tape, tied up in a parcel which has been tied up with even more red tape and it seems to me that the only reason for most of the layers of red tape, is to extract more money in either legitimate fees or more bungs just to be able to move on to the next layer of RED TAPE.

Iain.

[aromulus]

Walay kwartaaaaaaaa

[andypaul]

You're absolutely right. The life of a worker in early industrial Britain was pretty crap. Much like the situation now in sweatshops in China etc - but it didn't last. They got together and won better working conditions, pay, health and safety, the 8 hour day etc. This was replicated in other industrial nations.

Now, none of us would really chose to go back to pre-industrial times. You only have to look at the difference in life expectancy between developed and developing nations for one example of why having a modern industrial society is better. And certainly it is also reflected in the huge historical mass migrations to the west in search of what is perceived to a better life (although I agree, I do wonder sometimes about that suppose better life? ).

Many on here want the simple life and the programe im watching on 4 just now want to go back to basics.

The western way is not always the best way forward looking at the mess which is just starting. look at the lonely people with no true social life?
The two people who met nline and found they lived a street away and yet didn't know one another.

Many rush to the west to earn money and because they have been led to belive life is better here which it can be for some. But many who emgriate seem to find something spritual is missing.

We are having to relearn natural health cures which seem to have outlasted industrial medcines, many of which are now, either uneffective or a lot less effective.

With India and China moving towards the industrial age can the planet cope witht the extra pollution?

[eljean]

Government hold the biggest rule on the country's progress simple equation if the government is corrupt more society problems less opportunity if the government is not corrupt more opportunity and less society problems

[andypaul]

Government hold the biggest rule on the country's progress simple equation if the government is corrupt more society problems less opportunity if the government is not corrupt more opportunity and less society problems

The Uk is buggered then

[aromulus]

Government hold the biggest rule on the country's progress simple equation if the government is corrupt more society problems less opportunity if the government is not corrupt more opportunity and less society problems

The Uk is buggered then

Last one to leave turn the lights off.....

[vbkelly]

Walay kwartaaaaaaaa

lazy

[aromulus]

lazy

Who...???

[vbkelly]

Who...???

aw! not you dom the filipino people thats why poor

[Juana]

The only way for the Philippines to get out of poverty is to have a GREAT and BRAVE leader. A leader who treasure Filipino values, who does not favor anyone even his own family, who doesn't kiss a**, who is NOT AFRAID, who can "make corruption a socially unacceptable behaviour" like david said, and who is a patriot and loves his country more than anything else.
Now that's the leader we need.

hmmmm... now who would that be???

I don't think the 6-yr term for Presidents is enough to make a big difference as to what we are hoping to achieve. This is a group effort and not just merely by one body. Don't get me wrong, i do agree with you but as long as there are corrupt people in power, im afraid to say, this thing will get its way back.

[Jay&Zobel]

They are not poor, they have family values

I honestly agree with this...
Giving sustento to parents/families instead of Paying It Forward (like inheritance) but i love helping my family hehe (no question there)

[Jay&Zobel]

ALso braindrain! Plenty of Fiipinos are leaving the country (like us)! But who is to blame?

[aposhark]

The Pope could reduce poverty, enrich family lives and strenghthen poor countries overnight just by saying three words CONDOMS ARE OK!!!! ..... but then children might get educated and become more self reliant and begin to question some of the oher teachings and where would the catholic church and more impportantly the wealthy and powerful bishops be then?

Yeah, but people can buy condoms in the cities of the Philippines but not readily available in the poorer provinces.
Even if they were available, the people would buy food instead of condoms due to financial constraints.
Seems to me the Phils government should make it easier for the poorer people to buy condoms.

[Scouse]

After reading all of the posts here I think it is a combination of many factors that keeps the Philippines poor.

1. Lack of access to family planning -large families with mny mouths to feed means that there is no income leftover for other, preferably locally produced, goods.

2. The above leads to lack of industry - why produce goods you can't sell. Ford Motors grew because the cars were priced at a level that the employees (and therefore other workers) could afford.

3. Laziness - in my experience, Filipinos are no lazier than any other nation. If there is work to do they will do it, but natuarlly enough would you work as hard as you could if you were being paid nothing?

4. Education - The system is grossly underfunded. Those who want to learn can do but it takes a lot more dedication and effort than it does in the west. Given the condition of many schools, class sizes etc the teachers do a wonderful job.

5. Healthcare - Without a universal system it is hard for people who have nothing to get medical care. We may moan about the NHS but think about what a wonderful system it is. Free access/hospital care. We may have to pay for some things but if we had to pay for everything imagine how much you would have to spend.

6. Corruption - This happens in most countries, it just easier in the Philippines and they are not so clever at hiding it. Look at how many scandals there have been in the UK/USA when MPs/senators/political parties are caught out taking bribes.

Similarly, how many rich people in the UK pay their fair share of taxes? They use expensive accountants to hide their wealth to avoid it.

7. IMF/World Bank - Controlled by the developed countries with a brief to look after the developed world interests, hence the insistence of the opening of markets/privatisation of the utilities. Capitalism relies on a cheap source of labour. The World Bank/IMF know thus and won't do anything to upset their paymasters.

India and China are developing because they have nuclear capability and are big enough to stick two fingers up to the World Bank and IMF. They also have potentially huge markets available to the West which means they can make even more money.

[fred]

8. Lack of foreign investors mainly due to the 60/40 business ownership restrictions. Foreign land ownership bans have also been a big off put for serous investors too.
Around 9 local families warding off foreign investment at every opportunity is a major factor and will continue to be so IMO.
Even President Arroyo abandoned her land reform plans that would have been beneficial to the poor rural folk after she realized how this would effect her families haciendas..
She often crafted laws that were designed to promote her families own business interests and this is common practice amongst the Filipino elite that control just about all the power here.
No getting away from the main reason for poverty here in the P.I.
Corruption,Corruption and more Corruption!!

[baboyako]

you only need to look at somewhere like boracay to see whats wrong.

restrictions on foreign investments is really the problem.

the restrictions are there to support corruption. you wouldn't believe how easy it is to provide electrical power (sanitation etc..) to a place like boracay IF ONLY foreign investment was allowed and encouraged.