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  1. #31
    Moderator joebloggs's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Win2Win View Post
    The Tories have only promised a vote, they have not said that they will abide by it. What will happen is what happened in Ireland a few years ago, that is Cameron's plan.

    You get a vote, it is NO. We stay in the EU anyway, but Cameron uses the vote to negotiate. He gets some concessions, and we all vote again. If it's a NO, more concessions, and another vote. Until, like the Irish, we get fed up and vote YES. Cameron has no intention of leaving the EU, and never will. I'm saying that as a Tory voter last time. If you want a definite OUT, then the only option is UKIP. They'll get into power, so again, we will remain in the EU.
    He said a number of times he's pro Europe, so he would delay any vote for as long as possible, but some in his party have had enough and will defect to UKIP where they will have a vote.

    Backing for Ukip in Clacton is at an astonishing 64 per cent, while Tory support has crashed by 33 points.

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/ar..._campaign=1490
    http://www.filipinouk.com/forum/image.php?type=sigpic&userid=870&dateline=1270312908


  2. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Win2Win View Post
    The Tories have only promised a vote, they have not said that they will abide by it. What will happen is what happened in Ireland a few years ago, that is Cameron's plan.

    You get a vote, it is NO. We stay in the EU anyway, but Cameron uses the vote to negotiate. He gets some concessions, and we all vote again. If it's a NO, more concessions, and another vote. Until, like the Irish, we get fed up and vote YES. Cameron has no intention of leaving the EU, and never will. I'm saying that as a Tory voter last time. If you want a definite OUT, then the only option is UKIP. They'll get into power, so again, we will remain in the EU.
    That's how I see it Keith.


  3. #33
    Respected Member les_taxi's Avatar
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    Disagree Keith. I think the Tories have learned that if they promise the vote they will HAVE to give it this time. UKIP will never get into power, their best hope is a strong influence on whoever is in power by being in coalition with them.

    It is a bit like the Scots dilemma - I think the same way, that I would like to be out but financially it could set us back - it's so hard to call. The reason I want to be out tho' is - as we always talk about on here - control of our own laws, stuffing Human Rights Bill etc. and Border control.


  4. #34
    Moderator joebloggs's Avatar
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    You're wrong again Les, that's why a Tory MP has switched to UKIP, because even they don't believe him.
    http://www.filipinouk.com/forum/image.php?type=sigpic&userid=870&dateline=1270312908


  5. #35
    Administrator KeithD's Avatar
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    The thing is, the Tories are not going to be in power after the next election.
    Keith Driscoll - Administrator
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  6. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by les_taxi View Post
    Disagree Keith.I think the Tories have learned that if they promise the vote they will HAVE to give it this time.UKIP will never get into power,their best hope is a strong influence on whoever is in power by being in coalition with them.

    It is a bit like the Scots dilemma - I think the same way that I would like to be out but financially it could set us back - it's so hard to call. The reason I want to be out tho is - as we always talk about on here - control of our own laws, stuffing Human Rights Bill etc. and Border control.
    I would like to see it happen that way Les.


  7. #37
    Administrator KeithD's Avatar
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    Keith Driscoll - Administrator
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  8. #38
    Respected Member les_taxi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by joebloggs View Post
    You're wrong again Les, that's why a Tory MP has switched to UKIP , because even they don't believe him.
    No, he is more radical than the Tories that's why.


  9. #39
    Respected Member les_taxi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Win2Win View Post
    Show me where in that headline he actually says "We'll never hold a referendum on the EU"

    What he does say is this "Those are things we will be fighting for, but I don't see the case for an in out referendum on Europe.

    "We are in Europe, we have got to make it work for us."

    Now things have changed, being in Europe has got worse. Thanks to UKIP it's changed his hand and now he will if in power give us a vote.

    That is what I want to see - times change and politicians have to offer alternatives.

    He has had to change is mind - that's a good thing not bad.

    Labour simply don't and won't change, and that's bad for the public


  10. #40
    Administrator KeithD's Avatar
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    "During Prime Minister's Questions, Mr Cameron, who met with President of the European Council Herman Van Rompuy this afternoon, insisted there was "no case" for a vote." - Since then he has changed his mind = U-TURN

    I see nothing wrong with policy change, but Cameron has always been a staunch supporter of the EU, which is why he'd never leave it while he was in power, regardless of any vote.
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  11. #41
    Moderator joebloggs's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by les_taxi View Post
    No he is more radical than the Tories thats why.

    What year is it now 2014, calling Brown, but he's been in power over 4 years

    http://www.filipinouk.com/forum/image.php?type=sigpic&userid=870&dateline=1270312908


  12. #42
    Respected Member les_taxi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by joebloggs View Post
    What year is it now 2014, calling Brown, but he's been in power over 4 years

    He will now put it to the vote if re-elected. Labour won't - simple as that.
    That will cost you many votes as it will be played on by the Tories nearer to the Election


  13. #43
    Moderator joebloggs's Avatar
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    It will cost the Tories even more votes because they will not believe him and vote UKIP
    http://www.filipinouk.com/forum/image.php?type=sigpic&userid=870&dateline=1270312908


  14. #44
    Respected Member les_taxi's Avatar
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    Well let's wait and see - your lot want to keep us in this cess pit of crap!


  15. #45
    Administrator KeithD's Avatar
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    The Tories promised to get the deficit down. Yet it is bigger than ever, and the government is borrowing more than Labour did. So much for his promise, he lied to us on that.

    The Tories will lose at least 500,000 votes due to the bedroom tax. Never mind the fact that government finances are in a mess, the NHS is being trashed, and people on the street have no idea why the Tories keep talking about an economic recovery.

    Remember, I voted to get rid of Brown last time, this time I vote to get rid of Cameron.

    One day we may get a politician in power who isn't a useless with his head on another planet. So, anyone who is a public school boy, and lacks a degree, will get my vote. A real person, in the real world.
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  16. #46
    Moderator joebloggs's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by les_taxi View Post
    Well let's wait and see -your lot want to keep us in this cess pit of crap!
    Yes the Tories really have created the cess pit we're in for the last 4 1/2 yrs

    Bedroom tax under threat: Lib Dem MP launches private members' bill to cut back policy
    http://www.24dash.com/news/housing/2...ut-back-policy
    http://www.filipinouk.com/forum/image.php?type=sigpic&userid=870&dateline=1270312908


  17. #47
    Respected Member SimonH's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Win2Win View Post
    The thing is, the Tories are not going to be in power after the next election.

    What odds are you offering on that Keith


  18. #48
    Administrator KeithD's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SimonH View Post
    What odds are you offering on that Keith
    4/6

    It would take a major disaster for Labour, and something wonderful for the Tories for that to change between now and the election. All the polls, of different demographics, all point to Labour. If you understand how statistics work, that type of reversal is extremely rare.
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  19. #49
    Respected Member les_taxi's Avatar
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    4/6
    Rubbish odds for the Tories having no chance


  20. #50
    Administrator KeithD's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by les_taxi View Post
    Rubbish odds for the Tories having no chance
    There are only 2 runners

    Chelsea v MK Dons would only be around 1/4
    Keith Driscoll - Administrator
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  21. #51
    Respected Member SimonH's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Win2Win View Post
    4/6

    It would take a major disaster for Labour, and something wonderful for the Tories for that to change between now and the election. All the polls, of different demographics, all point to Labour. If you understand how statistics work, that type of reversal is extremely rare.


    I can get 5/4 with Betfair


    http://www.oddschecker.com/politics/...ion/most-seats


  22. #52
    Respected Member les_taxi's Avatar
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    Yes but one millipedes moron hopefully will be a none runner.


  23. #53
    Moderator Arthur Little's Avatar
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    ... can't envisage 'Little Lord Fauntleroy' as future Prime Minister, somehow.


  24. #54
    Respected Member SimonH's Avatar
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    Vote for me

    Public school education, 1 'O' level in Maths, grade C GCSE in English, not doing too bad all things considered

    Come on........ Simon for PM


  25. #55
    Moderator Arthur Little's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SimonH View Post
    Vote for me

    Public school education, 1 'O' level in Maths, grade C GCSE in English, not doing too bad all things considered

    Come on........ Simon for PM
    Well ... my three forenames are Arthur James Balfour as were my Dad's. He in turn - third youngest in a family of 11 - had been called after Lord Balfour a distinguished early 20th Century Statesman, much admired by my paternal grandparents who'd [apparently] run out of names by the time of my father's birth in March 1912.

    That's where the "connection" ends; my CV for the job comprising:

    SCE Higher Grade in English & History
    SCE 'O' Grade in Arithmetic

    ... all attained through attendance at Evening Classes in conjunction with home study when in my 30s and worth bugger all!

    Why? Because those once-coveted qualifications were ... ... ten-a-penny by the 1970s and I remained a lowly penpusher throughout my entire working life.


  26. #56
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    I just checked your CV by the way. Nice job over the years!


  27. #57
    Moderator Arthur Little's Avatar
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    Well now ... there's a "turn~up for the book". Just heard on the latest news that Douglas Carswell - the subject of this thread, who defected from the Tories back in 2014 to join UKIP - has since quit the latter, while hoping to be able to continue representing his existing constituency as an Independent Member of Parliament.

    Probably there will be some (even many) who will readily criticise his actions. But ... ... as he explained on being interviewed, he'd only split from his original Party due to leading Conservatives (including the then Prime Minister, David Cameron) being staunch Eurocrats.

    Whereas,
    Carswell, was keen for to withdraw from the EU. Hence, his principal (arguably, even principled) reasons for allying himself to the Party that was totally committed to UK independence from Europe.

    However, as we're all aware, there's been a lot of water under the bridge since then ... not to mention more than a few surprises along the way!

    Added to which, there seems to have been regular, ongoing spats between Carswell's own supporters and those of former UKIP Leader, *Nigel Farage - *who's now claiming Carswell "jumped ship, before he was pushed"!

    So, all things considered, Carswell's move ... away from a Party he now believes to be a "spent force", is understandable given that he's confident our nation's future is secure in Theresa May's more than capable hands.


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